Service Areas on toll roads accessible from other roads

[jas]

Vauxhall doesn't count as a toll-beater NB because you could get out for free at the prior exit.

But doesn't this also apply to Cheesequake? You can get off for free at Matawan Road, or stay on and get off at the service plaza. Sure, it's an additional several miles for no extra toll, but that just means there's another short GSP section with no tolls.

NB, it applies. SB, it's the first entrance for several miles and by far the easiest access from 9.

I thought there were places where you could use the GSP accesses to avoid a toll, but a quick look turns up nothing. They can be used as "secret entrances" however, e.g. from Belmar Boulevard in Wall or Bordentown Avenue in South Amboy. The latter more or less counts, but it's really only a free section from Matawan Road, where there are no ramp tolls. (And per the Goog it's signed "official use and academy parking only", but maybe you can exit there.)

But the GSP toll structure is all fucked up post-one-way tolling.

I'm not sure if it is by design, but, each county along the GSP has one toll plaza.

Doesn't Bergen have two? Doesn't Passaic have zero?

My bad.  I thought the toll at I-80 was in Passaic County.  Also, (and I should have known this), Ocean County has two...Toms River and Barnegat.

[Alps]

]

I'm not sure if it is by design, but, each county along the GSP has one toll plaza.

Doesn't Bergen have two? Doesn't Passaic have zero?

My bad.  I thought the toll at I-80 was in Passaic County.  Also, (and I should have known this), Ocean County has two...Toms River and Barnegat.

More fun facts: Union has two toll plazas total, one mainline and one ramp (78 to GSP NB). Burlington has but one.

[jeffandnicole]

The one reason to go out of your way to a rest area: If you're a Roy Rogers fan in NJ.

There are so few Roy Rogers around (and they're just on highways), that I always wonder if what you are getting Roy Rogers food, or some other food branded as Roy Rogers.

[Alps]

The one reason to go out of your way to a rest area: If you're a Roy Rogers fan in NJ.

There are so few Roy Rogers around (and they're just on highways), that I always wonder if what you are getting Roy Rogers food, or some other food branded as Roy Rogers.

No, it's Roy Rogers. There are still a few standalone locations in MD.

[briantroutman]

The one reason to go out of your way to a rest area: If you're a Roy Rogers fan in NJ.

There are so few Roy Rogers around (and they're just on highways), that I always wonder if what you are getting Roy Rogers food, or some other food branded as Roy Rogers.

No, it's Roy Rogers. There are still a few standalone locations in MD.

Roy Rogers was started by Marriott in 1968 and its prevalence in turnpike service plazas is owed to Marriott having purchased the remains of Howard Johnson's in 1985–including many concession contracts. The turnpike operations got spun off into Host Marriott Services and eventually today's HMS Host, which is no longer connected with Marriott.

Marriott decided to leave the restaurant business and sold Roy Rogers (with over 600 locations at that point) to the parent of Hardee's in 1990, and that put the Roy Rogers brand in a virtual nosedive. After failed attempts to convert Roy locations to Hardee's, the new owners basically gave the brand minimal life support while hemorrhaging franchisees and selling of clusters of company owned locations to competitors. Finally down to about 60 locations in 2003, the former Marriott VP who launched Roy Rogers in 1968 bought the trademark from Hardee's parent in a comeback attempt. A decade later, they're down to about 40 locations, half of which (almost all non-MD stores) are in service plazas.

That said, there are differences between the company-owned standalone locations in Maryland and the HMS Host locations on turnpikes–probably more so than most fast food franchises. I think some supplies might be purchased in bulk from a HMS Host supplier rather than an exclusive Roy Rogers vendor. The Highspire Service Plaza near Harrisburg used to have a tiny Boardwalk Fries counter, and their standard hamburgers were exactly like those served by Roy Rogers at the nearby Blue Mountain and Plainfield plazas–just without Roy's Fixin's Bar.

[1995hoo]

The one reason to go out of your way to a rest area: If you're a Roy Rogers fan in NJ.

There are so few Roy Rogers around (and they're just on highways), that I always wonder if what you are getting Roy Rogers food, or some other food branded as Roy Rogers.

No, it's Roy Rogers. There are still a few standalone locations in MD.

Virginia as well. There's one about five minutes from my house and another reasonably close by; I also know of one in Front Royal and two in Leesburg, as well as the ones in Maryland (several in the Frederick area, at least one in Gaithersburg, I think another in Germantown, and I know there are others but unless I look at their website I won't remember where).

[vdeane]

probably more so than most fast food franchises.

I'm thinking of the contrast between Pizza Hut and McDonalds now.  Pizza Hut's service plaza/food court locations are true fast food while their standalone locations are sit-down restaraunts.  The only differences between a standalone McDonalds and a service plaza one is the lack of McFlurrys (due to their ownership of the adjacent Edy's service plaza locations) and play areas.

[theline]

Being from the Midwest, I haven't been to a Roy Rogers in over 30 years. Does the cashier still say "Happy Trails" after you pay? If so, it would be worthwhile finding one the next time I go east.

Photo stolen from somebody on the internet, who stole it from somebody else.

[Brandon]

probably more so than most fast food franchises.

I'm thinking of the contrast between Pizza Hut and McDonalds now.  Pizza Hut's service plaza/food court locations are true fast food while their standalone locations are sit-down restaraunts.  The only differences between a standalone McDonalds and a service plaza one is the lack of McFlurrys (due to their ownership of the adjacent Edy's service plaza locations) and play areas.

That must be an East Coast difference.  The ISTHA Oasis McDonald's do have the full menu, including McFlurries.  IIRC, the O'Hare Oasis and Lincoln Oasis even have PlayPlaces.

[vdeane]

It might be a Thruway difference.  Or an "Edy's is right next to McDonalds" difference.  The one I have the most experience with is the Warners travel plaza.

[briantroutman]

Does the cashier still say "Happy Trails" after you pay?

Unfortunately, no. But if you order large fries, they come in a "holster" (complete with fake leather tone, rivets, and stitching) that has slits so you can actually attach it to your belt.

The only differences between a standalone McDonalds and a service plaza one is the lack of McFlurrys...

That must be an East Coast difference.

I don't think it's necessarily a regional thing or a standalone vs. service plaza thing. I'm pretty sure I've seen McFlurrys at several eastern service plazas. More likely, I'd imagine it comes down to a peculiarity with a specific franchisee (cutting what for them is an unprofitable item), maybe the inability to accommodate the equipment needed for certain items due to space limitations, or something else. The franchise agreement mandates certain absolute menu requirements (you'd never ever see a McDonald's that didn't have Big Macs), but there is probably a little room for flexibility due to special circumstances.

Pizza Hut's service plaza/food court locations are true fast food while their standalone locations are sit-down restaraunts.

I'd say Pizza Hut is even more complicated than that. They also have co-branded KFC or Taco Bell stores, completely unstaffed hot racks in truck stops, delivery/pick-up only locations–all with differing menus and promotions.

[1995hoo]

.... The franchise agreement mandates certain absolute menu requirements (you'd never ever see a McDonald's that didn't have Big Macs), but there is probably a little room for flexibility due to special circumstances.

....

McDonald's locations in India don't sell Big Macs nor any other beef products due to the local taboo regarding beef consumption. Of course, I'd consider that a "special circumstance."

[PHLBOS]

The Lexington area is within the N-E quadrant of the MA-2A cloverleaf

I believe you meant to say S-E quadrant of the MA 2A cloverleaf.

I believe the service plaza along MA 128 North in Beverly, just after Exit 19 (Sohier Rd./Brimball Ave.), was also a HoJos at one time.

[Beeper1]

Oh yeah.  That's what I meant.        All of the service plazas on Mass highways were originally Howard Johnson's, both the turnpike and on the non-toll roads. 

[briantroutman]

The Lexington area is within the N-E quadrant of the MA-2A cloverleaf...

Anyone know what that closed-off small loop near the entrance ramp was? The Google satellite images going back to  the mid '90s appear to show it being closed and vacant, and historic aerials up to 1969 show that it wasn't even there at the time. Images from 1977 and 1981 do show it, though, but it's hard to make out what it was. So whatever it was maybe had a shelf life roughly spanning the 1970s and '80s?

[Beeper1]

From the look of it on the ground (I stop there often), it looks like it may have been originally a small drive through stand for coffee of something, like the small Dunkin Donut drive-through buildings at the Mass Pike service areas.  But it looks as if it was never finished or open.

[cpzilliacus]

No, it's Roy Rogers. There are still a few standalone locations in MD.

Virginia too.

With more coming in both states.

[Brandon]

No, it's Roy Rogers. There are still a few standalone locations in MD.

Virginia too.

With more coming in both states.

Do wish they'd add stores further west.  We had two of them in the early 1980s.  One was at Marriott's (now Six Flags) Great America.  The other was on the middle level of Woodfield Mall.

[cpzilliacus]

Do wish they'd add stores further west.  We had two of them in the early 1980s.  One was at Marriott's (now Six Flags) Great America.  The other was on the middle level of Woodfield Mall.

Roy Rogers is concentrated (at least for now) in the East, especially Maryland and Virginia.  You can see where on their Web site here.

[PHLBOS]

Roy Rogers is concentrated (at least for now) in the East, especially Maryland and Virginia.  You can see where on their Web site here.

When did the one in Sturbridge, MA (Exit 1 off I-84) go away?   It's not listed on the website.  It was open last year; I ate there last summer.

Roy Rogers/Sabarro's at 241 Haynes St. Sturbridge, MA

Update regarding the above:  I was in Sturbridge this past weekend and the above-Roy Rogers/Sabarro's is now boarded up.  According to my brother, who lives in the area, it closed this past October.

A billboard located along I-84 eastbound at the CT-MA line now has a big FOR LEASE banner stretched across in a diagonal manner.

Note to MassDOT: the supplemental BBS listing restaurants off Exit 1 needs to have the Roy Rogers and Sabarro's shields removed.  Both were still present as of Feb. 1, 2014 

[briantroutman]

With more coming in both states.

Do wish they'd add stores further west.

I doubt it.

Since the Plamondon Companies bought the trademark and franchising system a decade ago and launched the "Roy Rogers Rides Again"  turnaround campaign, the number of locations has dwindled by a third (60 to 40).

Roy Rogers faces a number of problems which I suspect are insurmountable. First and foremost is that the traditional fast food burger market is mature and over saturated. Dominant competitors like McDonald's and Burger King are retrenching, pruning underperforming locations, and increasingly focusing on cost-cutting to remain profitable. Roy's will never be able to win that game any more than Ames could have beaten Wal-Mart.

And among burger chains, which are growing? For the most part, they're specialty players like Five Guys and Smashburger who sell burgers at prices often approaching double that of the major national players. Their selling proposition rests on serving never-frozen beef, high-quality produce, and fresh-cut potatoes. If Roy's does have a chance, it's as a high-quality and unique niche player. But as of now, they're not there. From the nondescript box-like buildings to the hard plastic seats in the dining room, everything about the experience is "Generic Middle-American Fast Food, c. 1980" .

Another thing troubling Roy Rogers, I think, is the same thing that made the Howard Johnson's brand toxic by the 1980s: their presence in service plazas–stereotypically high priced, mediocre quality, served by indifferent employees. If people outside of Maryland know Roy Rogers at all, its because they were forced to drive through Nowheresville, Pennsyltucky on the Turnpike and Roy Rogers was their only option. Not the kind of brand awareness that would make most people want to visit, if a Roy Rogers opened in their neighborhood.

For years, the McDonalds Corporation (not a franchisee, and not HMS Host) held the food concession contract at the Hickory Run Service Plaza on the NE Extension, and they actually bought a billboard facing northbound right at the Allentown Service Plaza–so you'd see the Roy Rogers sign then immediately afterward, a billboard with a huge photo of a Big Mac and the message "Better Things Ahead - Only 15 Minutes Past the Tunnel!"  How's that for an endorsement! Perhaps the only time that I've ever seen one service plaza advertising against another one.

Don't get me wrong, I personally like Roy Rogers, but I don't see that they're poised for any significant growth. Perhaps you'll see some more locations in their home territory, and the toll road contracts will likely carry over, but...

When did the one in Sturbridge, MA (Exit 1 off I-84) go away?

expect other off-turnpike outliers to drop off.

This site has (had) several solid reviews of highway-bound fast food chains, including one on Roy Rogers here.

[jeffandnicole]

Roy Rogers is more than just burgers though - they are also fried chicken and roast beef.

And maybe that is some of the problem as well...When someone says Roast Beef, Arby's probably comes to mind.  When someone says Fried Chicken, KFC & Popeyes are the front runners there.  Burgers - dozens of restaurants carry them.  Roy Rogers does all 3.

Roy Rogers may have tried to overreach their brand by doing everything, to the point where they are most well known for their fixings station and not much else.  I'm not sure lettuce, tomato, ketchup and mustard is a very huge selling point for people undecided what they want to eat.

[roadman]

Yes.  It was on the southbound side of I-93/MA-3 in Quincy, just before the Braintree split.  It wasn't in the median, but was tightly spaced between the adjacent properties along the highway in that densely populated area.  I have heard that the only reason it was built on such an urban, non-tolled freeway, was that Quincy was where HoJo's first started.  I don't know if this area just had a restaurant or if it also had fuel. Historic Areals doesn't seem to show a gas station, just one building for the restaurant.   I think it closed when the expressway was rebuilt in the early 80s.  The place was completely demolished and the land sold off to private development not connected to the highway, with no evidence of it left on the ground.

Both of the service areas on the I-95 part of 128 used to be Howard Johnsons, and they are both wedged into larger interchanges.  The Lexington area is within the N-E quadrant of the MA-2A cloverleaf, and the Newton plaza is within the connecting ramps between the Grove Street and MA-16 interchanges.   

The Howard Johnsons at the Braintree Split was closed during the 1984-1985 Southeast Expressway reconstruction project.  Removal of the service plaza, which required a very hazardous weave across five lanes to get from the restaurant to MA 3 south, was a condition of MassDPW getting Federal funding to rebuild the highway.

And, my recollection is that the plaza did have a gas station in addition to the restaurant.

[cpzilliacus]

With more coming in both states.

Do wish they'd add stores further west.

I doubt it.

Since the Plamondon Companies bought the trademark and franchising system a decade ago and launched the "Roy Rogers Rides Again"  turnaround campaign, the number of locations has dwindled by a third (60 to 40).

Roy Rogers faces a number of problems which I suspect are insurmountable. First and foremost is that the traditional fast food burger market is mature and over saturated. Dominant competitors like McDonald's and Burger King are retrenching, pruning underperforming locations, and increasingly focusing on cost-cutting to remain profitable. Roy's will never be able to win that game any more than Ames could have beaten Wal-Mart.

I can only provide three data points to counter that, in Maryland and Virginia.

Roy Rogers has sold new franchises at three locations relatively close to Washington - one in Burtonsville, Montgomery County, on Md. 198 (west of U.S. 29 and I-95); one in LaPlata, Charles County, Md. on U.S. 301; and one on U.S. 340/U.S. 522 north of I-66 in Front Royal, Warren County, Va. 

All three appear to be drawing plenty of customers - there was a Checkers next to the one in Front Royal that closed shortly after Roy Rogers opened.

It helps that brand loyalty to Roy Rogers has remained extremely strong in both states (similar to In-N-Out in California), and it may not be possible to replicate that in other parts of the United States (though I believe that In-N-Out would do well if they decided to expand beyond their current "footprints" in the West and in Texas).

[roadman]

As I recall, there was only one McDonald's location in the history of the company that closed - without relocating to an adjacent site - soley due to poor sales.  That was in Central Square, Lynn, in the late 1970s.  The restaurant was opened as one of the cornerstone fixtures of the failed Union Street walkway project.