I-95/Penna Turnpike Interchange

[MrDisco99]

Trenton isn't mentioned until you're in New Jersey.

It's shown as a control city in the Bronx:

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.8345292,-73.8825014,3a,75y,29.18h,86.41t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s40gxTPap58E_aeoaCCkfGQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

[cl94]

Trenton isn't mentioned until you're in New Jersey.

It's shown as a control city in the Bronx:

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.8345292,-73.8825014,3a,75y,29.18h,86.41t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s40gxTPap58E_aeoaCCkfGQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

That is an exception I have never noticed, likely because I have never had a reason to use the Sheridan. It is not used as a control anywhere on the Cross Bronx or Bruckner. Why Trenton was used is beyond me.

[NJRoadfan]

Trenton was used on older signs in NYC, they have since switched to using Newark.

[MrDisco99]

It's on the Deegan, too.

I never understood why Trenton is used as a control city anywhere on I-95 in NY or on the NJ Turnpike, considering the road doesn't actually go there.  I'm hoping once the ramps to Philadelphia are finished that they'll change those signs.  Not holding my breath, though.

[MrDisco99]

Trenton was used on older signs in NYC, they have since switched to using Newark.

Yeah Newark makes more sense from NYC I guess.

I think (once the connection is done) maybe some I-95 interchanges with major highways should be tagged with Philadelphia, though, just to show that there really is a way to get there now from the NY metro area.  I'm sure there's plenty of drivers between those two cities who have had to resort to using arcane driving instructions passed down over generations while ignoring the signs.

[KEVIN_224]

I-95 doesn't enter Trenton. True. Now tell those people in southern Maine, southeast New Hampshire, northeast Massachusetts and Providence that I-95 never enters Boston, although they use it as a control city in many cases.

I-84 ends roughly 55 miles west of Boston. Tell that to people in Connecticut from roughly Exit 45 in Hartford (Flatbush Avenue) to the Massachusetts state line.

Anyways...one still sees Trenton as a southbound control city at the I-95 exit from I-87 (Major Deegan Expressway).

[dgolub]

I'm sure there's plenty of drivers between those two cities who have had to resort to using arcane driving instructions passed down over generations while ignoring the signs.

Yeah, the hotels generally have use NJ 73 to NJ 90 to get across the river and then go down I-95.  Megabus uses NJ 73 to NJ 38 to US 30 to I-676.

[MrDisco99]

Something I just thought of... Are they going to adjust the ticket section tolls to accommodate the new bridge toll, or is that going to be just another increase for traffic doing the full mainline?

[roadman65]

I-95 doesn't enter Trenton. True. Now tell those people in southern Maine, southeast New Hampshire, northeast Massachusetts and Providence that I-95 never enters Boston, although they use it as a control city in many cases.

I-84 ends roughly 55 miles west of Boston. Tell that to people in Connecticut from roughly Exit 45 in Hartford (Flatbush Avenue) to the Massachusetts state line.

Anyways...one still sees Trenton as a southbound control city at the I-95 exit from I-87 (Major Deegan Expressway).

Control cities do not have to be on the route itself.  As long as its connected to it via another freeway or straight arterial.

Boston has I-93 for it coming both ways on I-95.
Boston has I-90 for I-84 after it ends.

Trenton has I-195 and US 206 for I-95 in NJ.

Heck I-95 uses Washington, and from the north you need to leave the interstate system by using the BW Parkway.  From the south you stay on I-395 after I-95 leaves it at Springfield.

In any case, all are served quite well.

[PHLBOS]

I-95 doesn't enter Trenton. True. Now tell those people in southern Maine, southeast New Hampshire, northeast Massachusetts and Providence that I-95 never enters Boston, although they use it as a control city in many cases.

It's worth noting (and most of us here know this) that I-95 was originally planned to go through Boston, Trenton (one early proposal had I-95 going through Trenton via the current US 1 corridor) and even Washington, DC; but key segments to make such happen were never built.

I-84 ends roughly 55 miles west of Boston. Tell that to people in Connecticut from roughly Exit 45 in Hartford (Flatbush Avenue) to the Massachusetts state line.

One has to wonder had the plan to build I-84 to Providence ever happened; would ConnDOT have changed those signs?  Another topic for another thread.

[swbrotha100]

Found this old article on Google on why Maryland signs I-95 north of Baltimore for "New York" as opposed to Wilmington or Philadelphia:


http://articles.baltimoresun.com/1993-12-20/news/1993354006_1_exit-signs-traffic-signs-new-york

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[The Ghostbuster]

The sooner this interchange is completed, the better. It's inexcusable that the gap in Interstate 95 has persisted for this long.

[BrianP]

The sooner this interchange is completed, the better. It's inexcusable that the gap in Interstate 95 has persisted for this long.

I'd say the gap has been a good thing since traffic passing through the region doesn't generally take I-95 through Philadelphia.  The interchange wasn't initially built as explained previously in the thread.  But in the intervening years it may have been that it wasn't so much a choice by the PTC as it was by the administrations in Harrisburg.  They wouldn't want the extra traffic to clog I-95 in PA since then they would have to find a way to expand the highway.

The part that I'd say is wrong is that I-95 should have been routed around Philly.  PA shouldn't have been able to have their cake and eat it too.  I-95 goes around DC and Boston so why not Philly.  I would replace I-95 through Philly as I-495.  I-95 through Wilmington would then be I-695.

But at least the way things have unfolded most travelers have learned to use the NJTPK.  And fortunately in the future new drivers will probably (fingers crossed) be told by their navigation system to use the NJTPK as well.

[roadman65]

Also to add to your comment, if NJ 90 was completed to Exit 4 of the NJ Turnpike it could have been I-395 giving Philadelphia plenty of access to the interstate despite it not being part of it.

Yes I-95 should be the full length of the NJ Turnpike as it is seen that way as is by the non road geeks.

As far as NJ 90 not even being built as not being considered in interstate mileage, NJ is very content on sticking to the original mileage set back in the 50's pretty much.  Heck the only reason why I-195 got to be one is because NJ cancelled I-278 in Union County where they were able to transfer the mileage over.

[cpzilliacus]

The part that I'd say is wrong is that I-95 should have been routed around Philly.  PA shouldn't have been able to have their cake and eat it too.  I-95 goes around DC and Boston so why not Philly.  I would replace I-95 through Philly as I-495.  I-95 through Wilmington would then be I-695.

I disagree. Had Pennsylvania NIMBYs succeeded in getting a long section of I-95 in their state cancelled, then by all means, I-95 should have followed the New Jersey Turnpike from bottom to top.  It would have become the logical choice at that point.

But it was NIMBYs in New Jersey that are the root cause of the discontiguous sections of I-95 today. Seems very unfair to Pennsylvania to route a 2di that they built away from their largest city, because of NIMBYist objections against the Somerset Freeway in New Jersey.

But at least the way things have unfolded most travelers have learned to use the NJTPK.  And fortunately in the future new drivers will probably (fingers crossed) be told by their navigation system to use the NJTPK as well.

Some will probably continue to use the N.J. Turnpike.  Others (including over-the-road owner/operator trucks) will probably use I-95 through Philadelphia, especially northbound, since there will be no toll to leave Pennsylvania on the eastern end of the Pennsylvania Turnpike East-West Mainline.  Not sure if trucks will save money on tolls southbound (I suppose it depends on what the toll will be to enter Pennsylvania as compared to the New Jersey Turnpike toll from Exit 6 to Exit 1, combined with the charge to use the Delaware Memorial Bridge).  I assume the distance staying on the Turnpike and across the DMB on I-295 will be a little shorter than staying with signed I-95 through Center City Philadelphia.

[Duke87]

I don't buy the argument that PA built 95 so why should they lose it or have to fix what NJ broke. It's an INTERSTATE highway, what best serves INTERSTATE travel ought to trump any feudal squabbles between two states over who has to deal with what.

Also, the needs of traffic trump the needs of a route number. The point of the 95/PA Tpk interchange is not to give I-95 a continuous route. It is to provide a direct all-freeway route from NYC to Philadelphia, which currently does not exist. It is only being signed as I-95 because that has been deemed the most sensible number to give it.

The lack of an interstate number on the NJ Turnpike south of exit 6 is odd, but does not decrease the road's utility. So, that's strictly for NJ to worry about, and they have chosen not to care.

As for the traffic impacts, the interchange will at least at first be limited by the Delaware River Bridge being only four lanes. That will likely become somewhat of a choke point, so there will be pressure to twin it. But this is for PA-bound traffic. I question how much traffic will go that way for the sake of toll avoidance. Any dedicated shunpikers will not be on the turnpike in the first place and will have crossed the Delaware for free at Trenton (or for a small toll, once Scudders Falls starts collecting them).

Trucks, meanwhile, already have an easy shunpike route by using 295 and 195 instead of the turnpike between 1 and 7A. For northbound traffic this will continue to be cheaper than taking 95 through Philly and using the new interchange, so I wouldn't worry about that. Southbound, I doubt there will be much if any savings either.

[roadman65]

Whether or not the Delaware Expressway is I-95 or not, the road is needed anyway.  I think many are pointing out that I-95 should have been on the NJ Turnpike from day one.  When the mileage was being decided five decades ago, it should have been given an x95 number instead, as even if the Somerset Freeway was being considered for economic growth in Central Jersey it still could have been it as well.

As far as an all freeway routing between NY and Philly, if NJ 90 was built and given an x95 route number as well, you would also have had the two cities connected by all freeway as well.  That would have even given the current Turnpike an all freeway link into Philadelphia as well which is needed.

Oh and may I remind you the lack of interchange between the NJT and NJ 42!  If that were built you would also have an all freeway connection between the two mid Atlantic marketing cities as well!

[hbelkins]

The point of the 95/PA Tpk interchange is not to give I-95 a continuous route. It is to provide a direct all-freeway route from NYC to Philadelphia, which currently does not exist.

Sure it exists. I-95 north becomes I-295 south to I-195 to the NJTP. Or I-76 or I-676 to I-295 to I-95 to the NJTP. 

[hbelkins]

Found this old article on Google on why Maryland signs I-95 north of Baltimore for "New York" as opposed to Wilmington or Philadelphia:


http://articles.baltimoresun.com/1993-12-20/news/1993354006_1_exit-signs-traffic-signs-new-york

ASUS ZenFone 2E

So AASHTO tells Maryland to use NYC but tells West Virginia to use Lewisburg, Clarksburg and Parkersburg? Ohhh-kay.

[roadman65]

The point of the 95/PA Tpk interchange is not to give I-95 a continuous route. It is to provide a direct all-freeway route from NYC to Philadelphia, which currently does not exist.

Sure it exists. I-95 north becomes I-295 south to I-195 to the NJTP. Or I-76 or I-676 to I-295 to I-95 to the NJTP. 

Yes in a very roundabout way, but yes.  However to some people on this forum and to local and state officials not so much because its not direct.

[bzakharin]

I'm sure there's plenty of drivers between those two cities who have had to resort to using arcane driving instructions passed down over generations while ignoring the signs.

Yeah, the hotels generally have use NJ 73 to NJ 90 to get across the river and then go down I-95.  Megabus uses NJ 73 to NJ 38 to US 30 to I-676.

With a very fortunate (for me) result of making an extra stop right at the Cherry Hill mall. I wonder if it will go away when the interchange is built.

[cpzilliacus]

Found this old article on Google on why Maryland signs I-95 north of Baltimore for "New York" as opposed to Wilmington or Philadelphia:


http://articles.baltimoresun.com/1993-12-20/news/1993354006_1_exit-signs-traffic-signs-new-york

ASUS ZenFone 2E

So AASHTO tells Maryland to use NYC but tells West Virginia to use Lewisburg, Clarksburg and Parkersburg? Ohhh-kay.

Ultimately Maryland decides. 

They have been posting mentions of New York as far south as the I-95/I-495 interchange in College Park since the "between the Beltways" section of I-95, from I-495 to South Caton Avenue (one interchange north of I-695) opened in the early 1970's (northbound I-95 traffic was encouraged by signs to follow the Outer Loop of I-695 south to I-895, then north on I-895 through the Baltimore Harbor Tunnel - when the I-895 extension from U.S. 1 to I-95 was completed, then that became the de-facto I-95 until completion of the Fort McHenry Tunnel in 1985).

As others have mentioned, U.S. 40, which runs parallel to I-95 from Baltimore to a point near Newport, Delaware, mostly uses Philadelphia as its control city.  Once the PTC's Bristol project is complete enough to complete I-95, I think Maryland may decide to mention Philly more frequently on I-95.

[roadman65]

Also on some old maps you will find that both the BW Expressway and Parkway were shown as Temporary I-95 for a short time before I-95 was completed between the Capital Beltway and Caton Avenue.

I do not know how that went, as trucks are banned south of MD 175, unless really they were thinking only about cars.  More than likely trucks were probably sent via MD 3 and US 301 like Richmond was always (and still is today from at least I-695)signed from the tunnel in the pre I-95 days.

[cpzilliacus]

I don't buy the argument that PA built 95 so why should they lose it or have to fix what NJ broke. It's an INTERSTATE highway, what best serves INTERSTATE travel ought to trump any feudal squabbles between two states over who has to deal with what.

That is the theory, and I wish it were correct - the federal government could then compel the Pennsylvania Turnpike Commission and PennDOT to remediate their collection of Breezewoods between sections of the Interstate network.  But unfortunately Pennsylvania has elected officials in the U.S. House of Representatives and U.S. Senate that would likely object to such an effort.

Also, the needs of traffic trump the needs of a route number. The point of the 95/PA Tpk interchange is not to give I-95 a continuous route. It is to provide a direct all-freeway route from NYC to Philadelphia, which currently does not exist. It is only being signed as I-95 because that has been deemed the most sensible number to give it.

Freeways should not have discontinuous sections, though I agree that this project will create, for the first time, a direct all-freeway connection between Philadelphia and North Jersey and New York, which matters IMO more.

The lack of an interstate number on the NJ Turnpike south of exit 6 is odd, but does not decrease the road's utility. So, that's strictly for NJ to worry about, and they have chosen not to care.

"Secret" N.J. 700 (and N.J. 444 and N.J.446 (ACE)) are remnants of the days when most toll roads in the United States had names only and not route numbers (at least for public use).  But drivers are used to all major highways having route numbers now, and it is time for NJTA, SJTA (and maybe NJDOT) to get with the program.

As for the traffic impacts, the interchange will at least at first be limited by the Delaware River Bridge being only four lanes. That will likely become somewhat of a choke point, so there will be pressure to twin it. But this is for PA-bound traffic. I question how much traffic will go that way for the sake of toll avoidance. Any dedicated shunpikers will not be on the turnpike in the first place and will have crossed the Delaware for free at Trenton (or for a small toll, once Scudders Falls starts collecting them).

Plans call for the bridge to be twinned.  Probably will happen when PTC has enough money (given that the massive bleeding to non-Turnpike projects consuming billions of Turnpike dollars continues).

Trucks, meanwhile, already have an easy shunpike route by using 295 and 195 instead of the turnpike between 1 and 7A. For northbound traffic this will continue to be cheaper than taking 95 through Philly and using the new interchange, so I wouldn't worry about that. Southbound, I doubt there will be much if any savings either.

I have used that shunpike route a few times, just for the sake of variation, and to see how the I-295/I-76/N.J. 42 project is progressing.  But I usually take the Turnpike.  It's faster and a few less miles if coming from the Delaware Memorial Bridge.

The opportunity is available north of 7A, but I also like to stop at one of the Turnpike's service plazas for full-service Diesel fuel, which is the cheapest I have seen on the East Coast, with the possible exception of South Carolina.

[cpzilliacus]

Also on some old maps you will find that both the BW Expressway and Parkway were shown as Temporary I-95 for a short time before I-95 was completed between the Capital Beltway and Caton Avenue.

I do not know how that went, as trucks are banned south of MD 175, unless really they were thinking only about cars.  More than likely trucks were probably sent via MD 3 and US 301 like Richmond was always (and still is today from at least I-695)signed from the tunnel in the pre I-95 days.

The Baltimore-Washington Parkway, between I-495 in Greenbelt and I-895 in Baltimore County, was indeed posted as TO I-95.  Trucks have never been allowed on the federal part of the Parkway, from U.S. 50 in Cheverly to Md. 197 in Odenton, with exceptions for military trucks and other trucks displaying federal government registration plates.

By signs on I-495 (Capital Beltway) and I-695 (Baltimore Beltway), trucks were directed to use U.S. 1, though I sure that more than a few used the Md. 3/U.S. 301 routing you mention above.