NFL: What the Hell?

[triplemultiplex]

Peterson spanked his kids. Big fucking deal. I got my ass beat when I was a kid using belts, switches, paddles, sticks, and other various objects. Now they call it "child abuse". It's gotten ridiculous.

There is nothing wrong with keeping your child in line, and sometimes the best way to prevent something is to beat the shit out of them so they know what will happen if they try it again.

Agreed. I've heard the Vikings want to bring him back next year. Good on them. Punching your wife is a fuckton different than hitting your kid with a switch. I never had a problem with AP.

"My daddy molested me, and I turned out fine!  I don't see what the big deal is!"

That's what you child beating apologists sound like.  You people disgust me.

[bugo]

Peterson spanked his kids. Big fucking deal. I got my ass beat when I was a kid using belts, switches, paddles, sticks, and other various objects. Now they call it "child abuse". It's gotten ridiculous.

There is nothing wrong with keeping your child in line, and sometimes the best way to prevent something is to beat the shit out of them so they know what will happen if they try it again.

Agreed. I've heard the Vikings want to bring him back next year. Good on them. Punching your wife is a fuckton different than hitting your kid with a switch. I never had a problem with AP.

"My daddy molested me, and I turned out fine!  I don't see what the big deal is!"

That's what you child beating apologists sound like.  You people disgust me.

There's a big difference between getting a spanking and getting fucked in the ass.

Some kids need to be spanked. That's the only way to get through to them.

[triplemultiplex]

Some kids need better parents who know how to discipline without resorting to outbursts of violence.

You don't beat a 4 year old child with a stick as punishment unless you are sick in the head.
Time to end this cycle.  Everyone who justifies this stuff sounds exactly like a victim of abuse. "I deserved it."  "I don't blame my parent(s)."  "It was my fault."

Replace "spanking" with "nighttime diddling" and it's the same argument.  It is carrying the abuse forward another generation.

Everyone who was spanked or slapped or some other type of physical punishment:  It's not your fault, you didn't deserve it and your parent or guardian didn't know any better because all they had to go on was how they were treated as a child.  Ask the opinion of any child psychologist and they will tell you, no way should you hit your children.  This is so well documented it's shocking parents still beat their children with objects like AP did.
Children don't learn the lesson you think they do.  They learn that daddy or mommy or grandpa or whatever is capable of violent angry outbursts and non-violent problems can be "solved" with violence.  But what do they know?  They're only "experts".  I'm sure everyone's frustrated grandpappy knows better then people who study this thing for a living.  Sure enough, look at all the people lining up online, on TV, everywhere, to defend a man who beat his preschool aged child so severely, he had to go the hospital.
Awful.

[Alps]

I hereby register my strong disagreement with 3mx. This is what led to the "entitlement generation" of millennials who need constant reassurance to stay on track, because they don't know how to make their own decisions.

[bugo]

I hereby register my strong disagreement with 3mx. This is what led to the "entitlement generation" of millennials who need constant reassurance to stay on track, because they don't know how to make their own decisions.

+1

I got spanked as a child, but not very often because I knew if I got out of line what would happen.

[cjk374]

Some kids need better parents who know how to discipline without resorting to outbursts of violence.

You don't beat a 4 year old child with a stick as punishment unless you are sick in the head.
Time to end this cycle.  Everyone who justifies this stuff sounds exactly like a victim of abuse. "I deserved it."  "I don't blame my parent(s)."  "It was my fault."

Replace "spanking" with "nighttime diddling" and it's the same argument.  It is carrying the abuse forward another generation.

Everyone who was spanked or slapped or some other type of physical punishment:  It's not your fault, you didn't deserve it and your parent or guardian didn't know any better because all they had to go on was how they were treated as a child.  Ask the opinion of any child psychologist and they will tell you, no way should you hit your children.  This is so well documented it's shocking parents still beat their children with objects like AP did.
Children don't learn the lesson you think they do.  They learn that daddy or mommy or grandpa or whatever is capable of violent angry outbursts and non-violent problems can be "solved" with violence.  But what do they know?  They're only "experts".  I'm sure everyone's frustrated grandpappy knows better then people who study this thing for a living.  Sure enough, look at all the people lining up online, on TV, everywhere, to defend a man who beat his preschool aged child so severely, he had to go the hospital.
Awful.

Sounds to me like you didn't get enough spankings and punishment growing up...or are you still growing up? 

Please tell me you weren't given "time outs".   

[bandit957]

The "entitlement generation" was caused when George H.W. Bush pardoned the traitors involved in the Iran-Contra scandal. That taught America's young people that there were no consequences for doing wrong.

[Pete from Boston]

The "entitlement generation" was caused when Jimmy Carter pardoned the traitors involved in dodging the draft. That taught America's young people that there were no consequences for doing wrong.

The "entitlement generation" was caused when Andrew Johnson pardoned the traitors involved in seceding and fighting against the Union. That taught America's young people that there were no consequences for doing wrong.

FTFY.  How far back do you care to keep this up?

[english si]

This is what led to the "entitlement generation" of millennials who need constant reassurance to stay on track, because they don't know how to make their own decisions.

Millennials are all 14 and over (save those born in the last 10 days of 1999). None of them are 4.

While some have made it about spanking, this isn't about spanking - it's about taking spanking way too far, and even more so, either not being aware or not caring that serious damage was being done to the poor lad.

Using a stick and breaking the skin once then stopping is troubling excessive force, but to carry on hitting the poor lad after breaking the skin is far more worrying.

[triplemultiplex]

I hereby register my strong disagreement with 3mx. This is what led to the "entitlement generation" of millennials who need constant reassurance to stay on track, because they don't know how to make their own decisions.

Oh please, that's not even a real thing.  Just some "kids these days" ramblings by old people not based in reality.  And to blame it on a lack of corporeal punishment is a complete fantasy.  That is such bullcrap and you have to know that.

Sounds to me like you didn't get enough spankings and punishment growing up...or are you still growing up? 
Please tell me you weren't given "time outs". 

I could take that as an insult directed at my mother if chose to.
My own upbringing is irrelevant.  So is everyone's anecdote.  What matters is aggregate outcomes.

Study this issue scientifically and we find out that children who are physically punished are more aggressive, more likely to get in trouble later in life and more likely to have emotional problems into adulthood.  Most importantly, it's the number one predictor for whether or not a parent uses corporal punishment.  This means we are passing this punitive, aggressive behavior to subsequent generations.

People's gut feelings about this issue are not supported by data.  So to continue to support this barbaric practice is to deny reality and unnecessarily inflict harm on defenseless children, even if they are being miserable little shits.

[Alps]

I hereby register my strong disagreement with 3mx. This is what led to the "entitlement generation" of millennials who need constant reassurance to stay on track, because they don't know how to make their own decisions.

Oh please, that's not even a real thing.  Just some "kids these days" ramblings by old people not based in reality.  And to blame it on a lack of corporeal punishment is a complete fantasy.  That is such bullcrap and you have to know that.

Sounds to me like you didn't get enough spankings and punishment growing up...or are you still growing up? 
Please tell me you weren't given "time outs". 

I could take that as an insult directed at my mother if chose to.
My own upbringing is irrelevant.  So is everyone's anecdote.  What matters is aggregate outcomes.

Study this issue scientifically and we find out that children who are physically punished are more aggressive, more likely to get in trouble later in life and more likely to have emotional problems into adulthood.  Most importantly, it's the number one predictor for whether or not a parent uses corporal punishment.  This means we are passing this punitive, aggressive behavior to subsequent generations.

People's gut feelings about this issue are not supported by data.  So to continue to support this barbaric practice is to deny reality and unnecessarily inflict harm on defenseless children, even if they are being miserable little shits.

You cite data. Show us this data. You strike me as someone self-righteous because you believe everything about your way is the best.

[Billy F 1988]

triplemultiplex, here's my issue with your quote, with what I said in this topic had been in fact backed up by the articles people have linked in their responses. I even made mention about the money issues with Adrian Peterson and provided a link thereof. So what I've said in all of my responses seems to you that I was just only responding out of gut feeling and not of fact. Well, I was responding out of fact backing up some of the people who provided the material. And I am in agreement with Alps. Your response to cjk to me was out of selfishness and because you believe everything about your way is best, that doesn't set well and up until this point, I had been nothing but civil and on point about this topic until you had to go on your little diatribe with cjk. I'm not a fan of this "entitlement generation" per se because I'm not that retarded in thinking that way. I'm quite the opposite. I work for what I want. I work my butt off not for my adoration or self satisfaction, but to ensure that what I do and the product I provide them is sufficient and that it meets their needs. You had just proven to me and to Alps this very fact about how self absorbed you are, self entitled to opinion, and self righteous. I'm going to get a bunch of flack for this response, I'm sure of it, but mark my words, triplemutliplex. Mark them. You need to take a hard look at yourself before you engage in any form of public discussion on the internet.

[cpzilliacus]

The New Republic: Americans Showed in 2014 They Don't Care How Awful the NFL Is

Just a few months ago, the "worst year in sports" was almost assuredly Roger Goodell's to lose. The NFL's commissioner, largely viewed as the tinpot dictator of a league that raked in about $9 billion last year, earned the ignominy after he'd issued two tone-deaf player punishments: the exceedingly harsh full-year suspension for Josh Gordon's ever-so-barely positive marijuana test, and the meager penalty for Ray Rice having KO'd his fiancée in a casino elevator. The Solomonic commissioner watched security video of the 212-pound Baltimore running back lugging Janay Palmer's limp body out of an elevator, then he decided to halve the punishment he gave to Gordon for going one toke over the line, then he split it again, and a third time: Rice was to rest for two games to begin the NFL season.

[Stephane Dumas]

The New Republic: Americans Showed in 2014 They Don't Care How Awful the NFL Is

Just a few months ago, the "worst year in sports" was almost assuredly Roger Goodell's to lose. The NFL's commissioner, largely viewed as the tinpot dictator of a league that raked in about $9 billion last year, earned the ignominy after he'd issued two tone-deaf player punishments: the exceedingly harsh full-year suspension for Josh Gordon's ever-so-barely positive marijuana test, and the meager penalty for Ray Rice having KO'd his fiancée in a casino elevator. The Solomonic commissioner watched security video of the 212-pound Baltimore running back lugging Janay Palmer's limp body out of an elevator, then he decided to halve the punishment he gave to Gordon for going one toke over the line, then he split it again, and a third time: Rice was to rest for two games to begin the NFL season.

That reminds me of these various articles about the death of the NFL
http://www.forbes.com/sites/leighsteinberg/2013/02/24/the-death-of-the-nfl/
http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/72781168/can-anything-kill-the-nfl-concussions-competing-league-oversaturation
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/17423602/death-of-football-thats-crazy-until-you-start-thinking-about-it
and some threads on City-Data
http://www.city-data.com/forum/pro-football/1569988-you-can-hear-whispers-nfls-death.html

It's like almost a self-fulfilling prophecy...

Let's imagine the following scenario about what if the NFL goes in decline? Will some healthly teams quit the NFL to create their own league or defect to the CFL? (this one is far-fetched but who knows?)

And I saw on Youtube a politically incorrect clip showing Ray Rice with a parody of Charli XCX's song "Boom! Clap!" but I decided not to post the clip on AARoads forum.

[ARMOURERERIC]

My catholic school nun principal did worse to me in first grade (1970) than what AP did, and when I threatened to go to the police, I got even in more trouble.

[triplemultiplex]

I post these links for the casual reader of this thread since I am pretty sure the child beating apologists will not even look at them or dismiss them out of hand.
This just the tip of the iceberg of what the social sciences have to tell us about corporal punishment; 10-15 minutes of casual research with Google Scholar.  These are professional journals, so some of them are not free, but at least read the abstracts.  We figured out spanking, etc. does more harm than good 40 years ago and every study confirms this fact.  I encourage anyone to do their own research.  You might learn something.

Hitting preschool children makes it harder for them to learn and causes them to act out.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/icd.758/abstract;jsessionid=983CAC2C4E78A45CF5A86B8CF33C954C.f01t01?deniedAccessCustomisedMessage=&userIsAuthenticated=false

Corporal punishment and it's link to domestic violence in adulthood.
http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/353973?sid=21104944248671&uid=4&uid=2&uid=3739976&uid=3739256
Spank your kids and they are more likely to hit their spouse.

Spank your kids and they are more likely to torture animals.
http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/354017?sid=21104944248671&uid=3739256&uid=70&uid=4&uid=2134&uid=2&uid=3739976

Adrian Peterson greatly increased the risk of his child growing up to abuse alcohol and drugs.  And it will take longer for him to relax.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1053811910008876

Children's perception of corporal punishment.
http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/353974?sid=21104944248671&uid=3739976&uid=4&uid=3739256&uid=2

Once again, Scandinavia leads the world in being less shitty to others.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0145213499000216
They banned it decades ago and the results have been beneficial.

A meta-analysis of 40 years worth of studies on corporal punishment.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0272735812001675

This study says you just might change your opinion about corporal punishment if you actually read up on its negative effects.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0145213413003189

I don't speak from authority, but my opinion is based on what experts figured out a long time ago.  Clearly this information is not being adequately communicated to parents in this country.
I will not apologize for my tone, however.  Small children should not be struck by adults.  Period.  It pisses me off.
I sympathize with anyone who had to endure this degrading and unnecessary punishment.  But just because you had to deal with that doesn't mean other children should.  Like I said earlier, it's time to end this cycle of violence.

[bing101]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/blog/bs-md-ravens-security-charge-20141230-story.html

Here is another scandal by the ravens Security guard accused of rape.

[Pete from Boston]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/blog/bs-md-ravens-security-charge-20141230-story.html

Here is another scandal by the ravens Security guard accused of rape.

Classy organization.

[bing101]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/sports/wp/2015/01/08/mueller-report-no-evidence-nfl-had-rice-video-league-should-have-done-more/

Here is a Ray Rice update.

[bing101]

http://m.espn.go.com/general/story?storyId=12145933&city=newyork&src=desktop&rand=ref~%7B%22ref%22%3A%22http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dnew%2Byork%2Bjets%2Bnews%26oq%3Dnew%2Byork%2Bjets%2Bnews%26gs_l%3Dmobile-heirloom-serp.12..0l5.3126.13193.0.14647.25.16.3.6.6.0.231.2615.0j14j2.16.0.msedr...0...1c.1.34.mobile-heirloom-serp..0.25.3032.ECWUHjdG8xQ%22%7D

Well the jets has to deal with weapon,charges.

[Pete from Boston]

http://m.espn.go.com/general/story?storyId=12145933&city=newyork&src=desktop&rand=ref~%7B%22ref%22%3A%22http%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dnew%2Byork%2Bjets%2Bnews%26oq%3Dnew%2Byork%2Bjets%2Bnews%26gs_l%3Dmobile-heirloom-serp.12..0l5.3126.13193.0.14647.25.16.3.6.6.0.231.2615.0j14j2.16.0.msedr...0...1c.1.34.mobile-heirloom-serp..0.25.3032.ECWUHjdG8xQ%22%7D

Well the jets has to deal with weapon,charges.

What, did a player say "Trade me or I'll shoot"?

[bing101]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12170950/indianapolis-colts-lb-josh-mcnary-placed-nfl-commissioner-exempt-list-rape-charge

Colts star charged with rape.

[Billy F 1988]

Oh my fucking God! What is the malfunction of these fucktards in the NFL?! Holy crap man!

[oscar]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/12170950/indianapolis-colts-lb-josh-mcnary-placed-nfl-commissioner-exempt-list-rape-charge

Colts star charged with rape.

"Star"?  He's only a backup linebacker.

[Pete from Boston]

Oh my fucking God! What is the malfunction of these fucktards in the NFL?! Holy crap man!

Let's not let off the fucktards at "lower" levels than the NFL (quotation marks because you can't get much lower) that cultivate this culture so the NFL always has fresh thugs to buy the services of.