Municipal Mergers- Who should consolidate

[Brandon]

This system has not given the municipalities more (as in liberal as in Democratic) political power in the General Assembly in Richmond.

The cities should have more power to govern themselves.

That's what home rule is for.  In Illinois, home rule is granted after a vote or automatically when the municipality reaches 25,000 in population.

Central cities are often neglected by the counties they are in - even though the people in the cities are paying most of the county taxes.

How is this not an unconstitutional form of taxation without representation?

Around here, it's the opposite.  The rural parts of the counties feel neglected by the urban areas.

That said, I feel that many municipalities in Illinois should consolidate, but they're not the worst offenders.  We should start with the school districts.  Illinois has more school districts per capita than any other state, including Texas and California.  We have a shit-ton of one-school school districts, even in urban areas.

[bandit957]

You might ask St. Louis and Baltimore just how well that has worked out for them.

From what I've seen in St. Louis lately, it seems to have worked out pretty good. I'd much rather live in St. Louis than in a Sun Belt suburb.

[bandit957]

This system has not given the municipalities more (as in liberal as in Democratic) political power in the General Assembly in Richmond.

The cities should have more power to govern themselves.

That's what home rule is for.  In Illinois, home rule is granted after a vote or automatically when the municipality reaches 25,000 in population.

The problem is that this often turns into "home rule for me, not for thee." Certain public officials and think tanks in Kentucky are the worst offenders. They think home rule should only apply when a city or county enacts a law they support. The problem is that some of the laws they support are unconstitutional.

[roadman65]

Consolidation? We need to be doing the opposite - by allowing more independent cities. In most of America these days, the rural areas hate the cities and vote against them. The cities should be allowed to become independent of counties that hate them.

This is a bad argument though because more rural areas in states also hate urban areas and vote against them. Ask an upstate New Yorkers and rural Illinoisian how they feel about NYC and Chicago. Do you propose that we allow each city to be its own state or district? Ask DC how not being in a state has worked out for them.

How come NYC never became its own state?  I find it hard to believe that it is part of the same state that Buffalo, Syracuse, and even Albany is in as it appears to be in a different world.

Plus I am sure that people as far away as Ripley is from the big city, that their citizens do not like paying taxes to keep the MTA running which does not serve anywhere near them.  Yes, I know now if New York City seceded from New York State, they could never survive on their own which is the present answer, but I am talking about ideally considering that other than money they like to do things much different than the rest of the state.

[The Nature Boy]

Consolidation? We need to be doing the opposite - by allowing more independent cities. In most of America these days, the rural areas hate the cities and vote against them. The cities should be allowed to become independent of counties that hate them.

This is a bad argument though because more rural areas in states also hate urban areas and vote against them. Ask an upstate New Yorkers and rural Illinoisian how they feel about NYC and Chicago. Do you propose that we allow each city to be its own state or district? Ask DC how not being in a state has worked out for them.

How come NYC never became its own state?  I find it hard to believe that it is part of the same state that Buffalo, Syracuse, and even Albany is in as it appears to be in a different world.

Plus I am sure that people as far away as Ripley is from the big city, that their citizens do not like paying taxes to keep the MTA running which does not serve anywhere near them.  Yes, I know now if New York City seceded from New York State, they could never survive on their own which is the present answer, but I am talking about ideally considering that other than money they like to do things much different than the rest of the state.

You could say the same for Chicago and Illinois, Atlanta and Georgia and increasingly Charlotte and North Carolina. The urban/rural/small city divide is very large in some cities.

Do Chicago and Cairo or Chicago and Springfield belong in the same state? Or Charlotte and Fayetteville?

Cities are becoming increasingly diverse and cosmopolitan. It doesn't matter if you're in New York, Illinois or even Georgia and North Carolina, there's going to be a rural/urban divide.

[Jardine]

I'm a big fan of municipal consolidation.  At some point due the rising administrative cost burden, it will be forced on the country.  I'd say starting the process pre-need would go much smoother than having it imposed via a state mandate or a bankruptcy judge.

For example, I could see Milwaukee extended south to the Illinois line, absorbing Racine, Kenosha, and all the towns and hamlets, and similarly, Chicago extend to the north to Wisconsin, absorbing Zion and all the rest.

When you contemplate the staggering cost of separate mayors, police chiefs, fire chiefs,  etc. for literally hundreds of enclaves in what is actually a single municipal/metro area  you have to realize that kind of profligate wasteful administrative burden will no longer be possible regardless of the hue and cry.  It simply won't be affordable, at all, and will have to change.

[bandit957]

I'm a big fan of municipal consolidation.  At some point due the rising administrative cost burden, it will be forced on the country.

I guess "forced" really is the proper word.

But there's also the issue of the people's natural right to band together for services. I think people have a right to form small municipalities. I'd rather have a municipality representing me than to have to go it alone.

[jp the roadgeek]

Also I was told by a native Connecticut resident now residing in Florida that Groton, CT are actually two separate entities as well.  You have the City of Groton, and the Town of Groton (which I think is equivalent to a township elsewhere outside of CT).

I believe that Greenwich has the same issue of being both a city and town in the same area.

Yes these should be merged.  Even in cases like Metuchen, NJ that is surrounded by Edison, NJ;  they should be merged as well.

Winsted should also merge with the town of Winchester, and Willimantic with Windham.  I believe Naugatuck also has a similar town/boro arrangement.

[NE2]

Willimantic should merge with Windham 32 years ago.

[Pete from Boston]

Milford should get with the times and merge with New Milford. 

[golden eagle]

Central cities are often neglected by the counties they are in - even though the people in the cities are paying most of the county taxes.

How is this not an unconstitutional form of taxation without representation?

That's an issue Jackson has with Hinds County. 80% of the county's revenue comes from Jackson (as well as having the overwhelming majority of the population), but we get the opposite share in county services. I'd love for the county and city to consolidate, but state law doesn't allow it.

[jeffandnicole]

I'm a big fan of municipal consolidation.  At some point due the rising administrative cost burden, it will be forced on the country.

I guess "forced" really is the proper word.

But there's also the issue of the people's natural right to band together for services. I think people have a right to form small municipalities. I'd rather have a municipality representing me than to have to go it alone.

If taxpayers are willing to pay for the duplicated services, no one will be forced to merge their services.

[mgk920]

Wisconsin is one of the 'poster children' states in this regard.  Nearly all of the state's metros, certainly including my hometown Appleton area, could make excellent use of full metro-wide municipal amalgamations, some involving 20 or more separate munis.

This even includes some very small places such the City of Redgranite (it's about 30 minutes west of Oshkosh on WI 21, with a 2010 USCensus population of 2149) and the adjacent Village of Lohrville (2010 population 402).

Wisconsin leads the USA - all 50 states - in the number of separate units of local government with taxing authority per-capita.  Illinois has the highest raw number of such munis while Hawaii has the lowest.

Mike

[TheStranger]

California's an interesting case in that much of the annexation/consolidation rush for municipalities died down after the 1960s, but by then, many independent suburbs had been established with little desire to lose their own identity (i.e. suburbs in metro Los Angeles that exist primarily to resist annexation by LA itself, such as Burbank).  San Diego did shoestring annex San Ysidro in 1957, and Chula Vista annexed the community of Montgomery (named after the nearby freeway?) in the 1980s.

San Jose intentionally expanded its sphere of influence in the 1960s-1970s as a form of growth - end result being largest land area, fewest independent suburbs, and largest (above 1 million) population in the Bay over time, aided of course by the tech boom.

On the other hand San Francisco County originally included San Mateo County until 1856, at which point the city of SF and its county became synonymous with each other (with no further expansion).  Absolutely no momentum in the Bay for consolidation.

Up in Sacramento County, several of the longtime suburbs have incorporated in recent years (Elk Grove and Rancho Cordova namely) while residents in Arden have resisted a push for becoming anything other than the status quo of county subunit - even if the area is indistinguishable from Sacramento itself and uses Sacarmento mailing addresses.

[Brandon]

Wisconsin leads the USA - all 50 states - in the number of separate units of local government with taxing authority per-capita.  Illinois has the highest raw number of such munis while Hawaii has the lowest.

You sure about that?  Have you taken into account all the sewerage districts, fire protection districts, school districts (including community colleges), library districts, and mosquito abatement districts in Illinois?  Yes, I said mosquito abatement districts.

Let's use school districts as an example.  I live in an area where there are no fewer than 6 elementary (K-8) school districts that feed into one high school district and are overlaid with a community college district.  Did I mention that 4 of these K-8 districts have only one school?  All 7 of these districts could be combined.

[jeffandnicole]

Wisconsin leads the USA - all 50 states - in the number of separate units of local government with taxing authority per-capita.  Illinois has the highest raw number of such munis while Hawaii has the lowest.

You sure about that?  Have you taken into account all the sewerage districts, fire protection districts, school districts (including community colleges), library districts, and mosquito abatement districts in Illinois?  Yes, I said mosquito abatement districts.

Let's use school districts as an example.  I live in an area where there are no fewer than 6 elementary (K-8) school districts that feed into one high school district and are overlaid with a community college district.  Did I mention that 4 of these K-8 districts have only one school?  All 7 of these districts could be combined.

New Jersey has 13 school districts that don't have any students.

[The Nature Boy]

I think the key phrase is "taxing authority." School districts often can't levy their own taxes. It's tricky but I think that "taxing authority" just refers to the entities with statutory authority to tax. Counties and towns often tax and give money to the school districts.

[mgk920]

Wisconsin has about 1900 unincorporated townships, along with about 600 or so incorporated cities and villages, several hundred school districts, 72 counties, etc, all with taxing authority.  Many townships also have one or more sewer and water districts ('sanitary districts'), all also with taxing authority.

And about 5.6M-5.7M people.

Mike

[Brandon]

I think the key phrase is "taxing authority." School districts often can't levy their own taxes. It's tricky but I think that "taxing authority" just refers to the entities with statutory authority to tax. Counties and towns often tax and give money to the school districts.

In Illinois, school districts are taxing authorities that do levy their own taxes.  Library districts, sewerage districts, fire protection districts, and even the mosquito abatement districts also levy taxes.

[Pete from Boston]

No Canadian commenters on the subject?  There seems to have been quite a lot of movement on municipal consolidation in Canada, even if there have been some opposing areas that managed to retroactively de-merge.

[admtrap]

California's an interesting case in that much of the annexation/consolidation rush for municipalities died down after the 1960s, but by then, many independent suburbs had been established with little desire to lose their own identity (i.e. suburbs in metro Los Angeles that exist primarily to resist annexation by LA itself, such as Burbank).  San Diego did shoestring annex San Ysidro in 1957, and Chula Vista annexed the community of Montgomery (named after the nearby freeway?) in the 1980s.

There's some justification for some of these suburbs to merge with one another, however.   Maywood outsourced essentially everything but it's council.  Neighboring Bell had the nice little corruption scandal.  Neighboring Vernon had one too.   Tiny Bell Gardens, Cudahy and Huntington Park haven't had any scandals themselves, but why not?  Put those six together, and you have one contiguous city of about 175,000 people covering about 16 square miles (a little bit bigger than nearby Downey), with a fair mix of residential and commercial.

Vernon managed to bribe its way out of forced disincorporation, but it should still be on the table at some point.

[6a]

San Jose intentionally expanded its sphere of influence in the 1960s-1970s as a form of growth - end result being largest land area, fewest independent suburbs, and largest (above 1 million) population in the Bay over time, aided of course by the tech boom.

Columbus did something similar, tying municipal water and sewer to annexation. In the process it became the largest city in the state (land and population) which annoys people from Cleveland and Cincy to no end. Isn't our fault you guys didn't plan ahead

New Jersey has 13 school districts that don't have any students.

I don't doubt you one bit, but do you have a link for that? It's hilarious and I'd love to read more about it.

[TheStranger]

California's an interesting case in that much of the annexation/consolidation rush for municipalities died down after the 1960s, but by then, many independent suburbs had been established with little desire to lose their own identity (i.e. suburbs in metro Los Angeles that exist primarily to resist annexation by LA itself, such as Burbank).  San Diego did shoestring annex San Ysidro in 1957, and Chula Vista annexed the community of Montgomery (named after the nearby freeway?) in the 1980s.

There's some justification for some of these suburbs to merge with one another, however.   Maywood outsourced essentially everything but it's council.  Neighboring Bell had the nice little corruption scandal.  Neighboring Vernon had one too.   Tiny Bell Gardens, Cudahy and Huntington Park haven't had any scandals themselves, but why not?  Put those six together, and you have one contiguous city of about 175,000 people covering about 16 square miles (a little bit bigger than nearby Downey), with a fair mix of residential and commercial.

Vernon managed to bribe its way out of forced disincorporation, but it should still be on the table at some point.

Here's a related question:

Wouldn't disincorporation into county-level administration (or not incorporating in the first place) serve as some sort of consolidation?  That is, areas that are already not independent not making a move to change that, but to rather serve as one of many discrete suburbs without municipal government entirely.  (This is I think why residents in Arden have resisted becoming their own city instead of remaining a part of Sacramento County's unincorporated area)

[NJRoadfan]

http://www.state.nj.us/education/data/fact.htm

The list is here (apparently there were 26 non-ops until 2009!): http://www.state.nj.us/education/news/2009/0701nonops.htm

[MikeTheActuary]

Wisconsin leads the USA - all 50 states - in the number of separate units of local government with taxing authority per-capita.  Illinois has the highest raw number of such munis while Hawaii has the lowest.

You sure about that?  Have you taken into account all the sewerage districts, fire protection districts, school districts (including community colleges), library districts, and mosquito abatement districts in Illinois?  Yes, I said mosquito abatement districts.

Number of Government Units by State in 2002:

Illinois: 6,904
Pennsylvania: 5,032
Texas: 4,785
California: 4,410
Kansas: 3,888
Ohio: 3,637
Minnesota: 3,483
Missouri: 3,423
New York: 3,421
Indiana: 3,086
Wisconsin: 3,049
[...]

Nevada: 211
Rhode Island: 119
Hawaii: 20
District of Columbia: 2

Source: US Census Bureau, Census of Governments, 2002, vol. 1,  p. 1