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Author Topic: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend  (Read 20414 times)

Finrod

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #225 on: July 21, 2020, 01:49:09 AM »

Looks like the recommended option for 31 and Business 31 south of Peru is the half-assed one, IMHO.
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silverback1065

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #226 on: July 25, 2020, 03:28:40 PM »

J-turns are cheap af too. most are barely $900k.
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theline

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #227 on: August 19, 2020, 12:22:59 AM »

 A fatality at the SR-110 intersection over the weekend, the third crash there in the last week, had INDOT again touting the effectiveness of upgrading the intersection to a J-turn:
https://www.wndu.com/2020/08/17/deadly-intersection-along-us-31-still-waiting-on-safety-improvements/
Quote
According to the Fulton County Sheriff’s Department, an accident over the weekend at that intersection claimed the life of 84-year-old Ralph Winters who is a former member of the Culver Town Council. His wife Barbara Winters was driving their Honda Pilot when they were struck by another vehicle heading south on US-31 as Winters was crossing on IN-110. This is the third crash at this intersection in the past week. Barbara Winters was transported to the hospital and her condition is unknown at this time.

Ralph Winters could still be alive if that J-Turn was in place.

“If we had a J-Turn there, a right angle crash would be less-likely, so it would be possible that having that reduced conflict intersection would make it less likely for that crash to occur,” [Cassandra] Bajek [spokesperson for INDOT Northwest] says.
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sprjus4

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #228 on: August 19, 2020, 12:28:06 AM »

And if an overpass was there, they would be on different levels crossing and unaffected.
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monty

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #229 on: October 06, 2020, 11:03:16 PM »

News 8 report on Wilson’s Farm Market:
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monty

silverback1065

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #230 on: October 07, 2020, 12:24:19 PM »

valid concerns, but there really doesnt need to be an exit at 256th, especially for just one business. he should just have them sign it on one of the blue signs at the exits before.
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Great Lakes Roads

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #231 on: January 12, 2021, 08:10:20 PM »

https://www.kokomotribune.com/news/local_news/new-indot-proposal-includes-us-31-division-rd-interchange/article_4baf8a92-54e7-11eb-aeda-0727ebb4e607.html

Well, the Division Road Interchange is back on the drawing board! However, that means the elimination and transfer of Indiana SR 213 to Tipton County.
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I-39

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #232 on: January 12, 2021, 09:10:04 PM »

https://www.kokomotribune.com/news/local_news/new-indot-proposal-includes-us-31-division-rd-interchange/article_4baf8a92-54e7-11eb-aeda-0727ebb4e607.html

Well, the Division Road Interchange is back on the drawing board! However, that means the elimination and transfer of Indiana SR 213 to Tipton County.

I didn’t realize they decided to go full freeway between SR 38 and Kokomo, what changed? Kind of make sense for commuter traffic into Indianapolis.
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silverback1065

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #233 on: January 12, 2021, 09:12:40 PM »

Kind of weird they want to get rid of 213, I wonder if they'll give hamilton county their portion too?

Pixel 5

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cabiness42

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #234 on: January 12, 2021, 10:20:55 PM »

https://www.kokomotribune.com/news/local_news/new-indot-proposal-includes-us-31-division-rd-interchange/article_4baf8a92-54e7-11eb-aeda-0727ebb4e607.html

Well, the Division Road Interchange is back on the drawing board! However, that means the elimination and transfer of Indiana SR 213 to Tipton County.

It's been a while since I've been on either one, but I remember 213 being a busier route than 19 between 22 and 28, so it's weird to get rid of 213.
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hockeyjohn

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #235 on: January 13, 2021, 09:28:41 AM »

I'd recommend to INDOT turning back the stretch of SR 19 north of Tipton (SR 28 to US-35); route SR 19 onto SR 28 east to the present SR 213 and then route it north.   The maintains a state highway through Windfall and shortens the US-35/SR 22/SR 19 triplex by several miles.    The portion of SR 213 south of SR 28 could remain or be turned back if INDOT is hellbent to remove a certain amount of mileage.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #236 on: January 13, 2021, 06:10:40 PM »

What configuration would the new US 31 interchange at Division Rd. be built in? Would it have roundabouts at the ramp terminals like the one at SR 28 does?
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ibthebigd

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #237 on: January 13, 2021, 06:45:50 PM »

Does anyone know Mayor Pete's stance on US 31 becoming an interstate? If Congress ever gets a transportation bill going could he influence US 31 becoming I-67 to Grand Rapids?

SM-G950U

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silverback1065

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #238 on: January 13, 2021, 07:06:45 PM »

What configuration would the new US 31 interchange at Division Rd. be built in? Would it have roundabouts at the ramp terminals like the one at SR 28 does?
probably too early to tell.
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skluth

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #239 on: January 13, 2021, 07:08:02 PM »

Does anyone know Mayor Pete's stance on US 31 becoming an interstate? If Congress ever gets a transportation bill going could he influence US 31 becoming I-67 to Grand Rapids?

SM-G950U

You're right that it won't be by itself.  I'm guessing Biden will want to do some infrastructure projects; they look good politically by creating jobs and generally make proponents of said infrastructure (including many voters) happy. A highway that is nearly to interstate standards could be considered an easy-to-attain project so it wouldn't surprise me. I wouldn't expect it to connect directly with I-196 at its north end because of the endangered species issue and Michigan is already working on the workaround. An new infrastructure bill should at least spur the completion of the I-94 connection. I don't know if either the Keystone Parkway or Meridian St could be upgraded to interstate standards, so that may hold back an I-67 regardless.
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hbelkins

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #240 on: January 13, 2021, 07:29:16 PM »

Does anyone know Mayor Pete's stance on US 31 becoming an interstate? If Congress ever gets a transportation bill going could he influence US 31 becoming I-67 to Grand Rapids?

SM-G950U

You're right that it won't be by itself.  I'm guessing Biden will want to do some infrastructure projects; they look good politically by creating jobs and generally make proponents of said infrastructure (including many voters) happy. A highway that is nearly to interstate standards could be considered an easy-to-attain project so it wouldn't surprise me. I wouldn't expect it to connect directly with I-196 at its north end because of the endangered species issue and Michigan is already working on the workaround. An new infrastructure bill should at least spur the completion of the I-94 connection. I don't know if either the Keystone Parkway or Meridian St could be upgraded to interstate standards, so that may hold back an I-67 regardless.

I'm going to guess that there might be more luck with BUILD grants (or whatever they will be called). Kentucky got a few of them because Elaine Chao is married to Mitch McConnell. Buttgieg, being from Indiana, might be more inclined to award grants to his home state.
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cabiness42

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #241 on: January 13, 2021, 07:39:52 PM »

I don't know if either the Keystone Parkway or Meridian St could be upgraded to interstate standards, so that may hold back an I-67 regardless.

Meridian St (US 31) is freeway from I-465 through Carmel, so no upgrades needed there.
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Joe The Dragon

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #242 on: January 13, 2021, 08:35:08 PM »

Keystone Parkway get rid of the lights at I-465
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tdindy88

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #243 on: January 13, 2021, 08:57:57 PM »

I'd recommend to INDOT turning back the stretch of SR 19 north of Tipton (SR 28 to US-35); route SR 19 onto SR 28 east to the present SR 213 and then route it north.   The maintains a state highway through Windfall and shortens the US-35/SR 22/SR 19 triplex by several miles.    The portion of SR 213 south of SR 28 could remain or be turned back if INDOT is hellbent to remove a certain amount of mileage.

That's not a bad idea. SR 19 north of Tipton doesn't appear to be serving much and I would guess not too many people would miss it. The same with SR 213 south of SR 28. But more than all of that, why does SR 19 have that ridiculous multiplex with US 35 and SR 22 and SR 13 and SR 18? The same state that is perfectly fine with two segments to SR 26, a long state-wide highway, just so that it doesn't have to maintain a few miles through Lafayette and West Lafayette, must keep SR 19 all intact?

And how bad are the state's finances if the two choices or either the Division Road interchange or SR 213 in Tipton County? How much is it to maintain that highway on a year-to-year basis. I would assume being a two-lane highway in rural Tipton County shouldn't be breaking the bank that much.
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silverback1065

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #244 on: January 13, 2021, 09:00:44 PM »

I'd recommend to INDOT turning back the stretch of SR 19 north of Tipton (SR 28 to US-35); route SR 19 onto SR 28 east to the present SR 213 and then route it north.   The maintains a state highway through Windfall and shortens the US-35/SR 22/SR 19 triplex by several miles.    The portion of SR 213 south of SR 28 could remain or be turned back if INDOT is hellbent to remove a certain amount of mileage.

That's not a bad idea. SR 19 north of Tipton doesn't appear to be serving much and I would guess not too many people would miss it. The same with SR 213 south of SR 28. But more than all of that, why does SR 19 have that ridiculous multiplex with US 35 and SR 22 and SR 13 and SR 18? The same state that is perfectly fine with two segments to SR 26, a long state-wide highway, just so that it doesn't have to maintain a few miles through Lafayette and West Lafayette, must keep SR 19 all intact?

And how bad are the state's finances if the two choices or either the Division Road interchange or SR 213 in Tipton County? How much is it to maintain that highway on a year-to-year basis. I would assume being a two-lane highway in rural Tipton County shouldn't be breaking the bank that much.

that 19 multiplex is new. 19 always had a gap until about a decade ago. and i've heard indot is rethinking 31 and 30 and reevaluating the cooridors. what it means for 31 is obvious, it will be full limited access. for 30? no idea...
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I-39

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #245 on: January 13, 2021, 09:19:58 PM »

Does anyone know Mayor Pete's stance on US 31 becoming an interstate? If Congress ever gets a transportation bill going could he influence US 31 becoming I-67 to Grand Rapids?

SM-G950U

You're right that it won't be by itself.  I'm guessing Biden will want to do some infrastructure projects; they look good politically by creating jobs and generally make proponents of said infrastructure (including many voters) happy. A highway that is nearly to interstate standards could be considered an easy-to-attain project so it wouldn't surprise me. I wouldn't expect it to connect directly with I-196 at its north end because of the endangered species issue and Michigan is already working on the workaround. An new infrastructure bill should at least spur the completion of the I-94 connection. I don't know if either the Keystone Parkway or Meridian St could be upgraded to interstate standards, so that may hold back an I-67 regardless.

I don’t think a full freeway upgrade north of Kokomo is coming anytime soon. InDOT only seems intent on making the corridor free flowing, and it seems the “interchanges” being put in north of Kokomo are not traditional freeway interchanges. Plus, there’s the whole US 20/31 multiplex that’s not fully up to interstate standards.
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monty

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #246 on: January 13, 2021, 11:23:04 PM »

SR 19 traffic volume is nearly double that of SR 213 in Tipton County. Tipton people going to Kokomo use SR 19. Grain traffic to Cargill and local truck traffic the same. The “swap” is an interesting proposal. Makes legitimate sense and achieves long term local goals.  Maintaining SR 213 as a county road shouldn’t be too challenging for Tipton or Hamilton Counties. It’s in good shape (especially in Tipton Co) but would be a large INDOT investment to achieve their future standards (narrow ROW and pavement width in Hamilton).  US 31 from Kokomo to Indy will be 100% limited access with no at grade access.  INDOT promising no stop lights from north side SR 931 Kokomo interchange to US 30 in Plymouth utilizing less expensive intersection improvements (J turns and partial interchanges).
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monty

theline

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #247 on: January 14, 2021, 01:07:18 AM »

Does anyone know Mayor Pete's stance on US 31 becoming an interstate? If Congress ever gets a transportation bill going could he influence US 31 becoming I-67 to Grand Rapids?

SM-G950U

You're right that it won't be by itself.  I'm guessing Biden will want to do some infrastructure projects; they look good politically by creating jobs and generally make proponents of said infrastructure (including many voters) happy. A highway that is nearly to interstate standards could be considered an easy-to-attain project so it wouldn't surprise me. I wouldn't expect it to connect directly with I-196 at its north end because of the endangered species issue and Michigan is already working on the workaround. An new infrastructure bill should at least spur the completion of the I-94 connection. I don't know if either the Keystone Parkway or Meridian St could be upgraded to interstate standards, so that may hold back an I-67 regardless.

I'm going to guess that there might be more luck with BUILD grants (or whatever they will be called). Kentucky got a few of them because Elaine Chao is married to Mitch McConnell. Buttgieg, being from Indiana, might be more inclined to award grants to his home state.
As a South Bend resident, I can attest that this city has had a long bi-partisan interest in raising US-31 between here and Indianapolis to full freeway status, with or without putting an Interstate number on it. While Pete will no doubt have his focus on the big picture, he still has planty of friends in South Bend, including his successor as mayor. If slapping an "I" on the route might help getting funding, then that might happen.

If a future Interstate route is to continue north from the US-20 interchange on the south side, it's true that some improvement would be needed to bring the route up to standards. The main improvement would be to that interchange, a sub-standard cloverleaf. Many other improvements to the South Bend bypass have accomplished in recent years.
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cabiness42

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #248 on: January 14, 2021, 07:12:40 AM »

Connecting the segments of 19 never made sense to begin with. If you're going from Noblesville to Amboy, it's faster to take 37->213->22->CR 1100 E (which is a highway quality road), than to just take 19 and those stupid-ass concurrencies.

If that part of 19 really is more used than 213, then fine, keep it, but please renumber it to 21
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I-39

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Re: More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend
« Reply #249 on: January 14, 2021, 09:44:21 AM »

Does anyone know Mayor Pete's stance on US 31 becoming an interstate? If Congress ever gets a transportation bill going could he influence US 31 becoming I-67 to Grand Rapids?

SM-G950U

You're right that it won't be by itself.  I'm guessing Biden will want to do some infrastructure projects; they look good politically by creating jobs and generally make proponents of said infrastructure (including many voters) happy. A highway that is nearly to interstate standards could be considered an easy-to-attain project so it wouldn't surprise me. I wouldn't expect it to connect directly with I-196 at its north end because of the endangered species issue and Michigan is already working on the workaround. An new infrastructure bill should at least spur the completion of the I-94 connection. I don't know if either the Keystone Parkway or Meridian St could be upgraded to interstate standards, so that may hold back an I-67 regardless.

I'm going to guess that there might be more luck with BUILD grants (or whatever they will be called). Kentucky got a few of them because Elaine Chao is married to Mitch McConnell. Buttgieg, being from Indiana, might be more inclined to award grants to his home state.
As a South Bend resident, I can attest that this city has had a long bi-partisan interest in raising US-31 between here and Indianapolis to full freeway status, with or without putting an Interstate number on it. While Pete will no doubt have his focus on the big picture, he still has planty of friends in South Bend, including his successor as mayor. If slapping an "I" on the route might help getting funding, then that might happen.

If a future Interstate route is to continue north from the US-20 interchange on the south side, it's true that some improvement would be needed to bring the route up to standards. The main improvement would be to that interchange, a sub-standard cloverleaf. Many other improvements to the South Bend bypass have accomplished in recent years.

The issue is, the improvements InDOT is planning north of Kokomo are not to interstate standards, including the proposed "interchanges" (as proposed, the interchanges proposed along this segment really aren't proper freeway interchanges). If they want to get a freeway along the corridor, perhaps the congressional delegation will need to take a page from Arkansas and designate the route as "Future I-67" like Arkansas did with "Future I-57". That will guarantee any upgrades will need to be done to Interstate standards.
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