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Author Topic: I-49 in Arkansas  (Read 800963 times)

The Ghostbuster

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2650 on: September 03, 2020, 02:23:15 PM »

The Bella Vista Bypass was planned to be a toll road: http://www.arkansashighways.com/BVB/Copy%20of%20bellavista.aspx. I assume plans to make it a toll road were abandoned long ago, right?
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MikieTimT

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2651 on: September 03, 2020, 03:55:59 PM »

The Bella Vista Bypass was planned to be a toll road: http://www.arkansashighways.com/BVB/Copy%20of%20bellavista.aspx. I assume plans to make it a toll road were abandoned long ago, right?

Long ago.  This was funded by the sales tax Arkansas passed about 8 years ago to fund road projects around the state.  Toll roads have consistently been shown in studies to not pay back bonds in Arkansas.
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US71

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2652 on: September 03, 2020, 04:49:28 PM »

The Bella Vista Bypass was planned to be a toll road: http://www.arkansashighways.com/BVB/Copy%20of%20bellavista.aspx. I assume plans to make it a toll road were abandoned long ago, right?

Long ago.  This was funded by the sales tax Arkansas passed about 8 years ago to fund road projects around the state.  Toll roads have consistently been shown in studies to not pay back bonds in Arkansas.

If my remembrances are correct, state highway law would have had to be changed to allow a public toll road.

OTOH, XNA was going to build a privately owned toll road from the 412 Bypass to the regional airport....emphasis WAS. They have since sweet-talked ARDOT into building a publicly funded access road for them.
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MikieTimT

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2653 on: September 03, 2020, 06:58:42 PM »

The Bella Vista Bypass was planned to be a toll road: http://www.arkansashighways.com/BVB/Copy%20of%20bellavista.aspx. I assume plans to make it a toll road were abandoned long ago, right?

Long ago.  This was funded by the sales tax Arkansas passed about 8 years ago to fund road projects around the state.  Toll roads have consistently been shown in studies to not pay back bonds in Arkansas.

If my remembrances are correct, state highway law would have had to be changed to allow a public toll road.

OTOH, XNA was going to build a privately owned toll road from the 412 Bypass to the regional airport....emphasis WAS. They have since sweet-talked ARDOT into building a publicly funded access road for them.

There is actually an Arkansas Turnpike Authority website.  Not much content there, but apparently they've got a placeholder if tolls ever do take off here.  I thought they actually did change the law to allow tolls many years ago, but that doesn't mean they're actually feasible for any projects here.

The road to XNA isn't very long from the junction with AR-612 once it's constructed in the area.  Pretty much every other airport in the state has an AR-980 going to it, so it likely didn't take much sweet talking to do a publicly funded connector.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2020, 07:02:54 PM by MikieTimT »
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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2654 on: September 08, 2020, 09:39:48 PM »

It's not good that Bing added it so early, but who actually uses Bing Maps?

I used to, back when the freeways were purple and the tollways were green, since it was much easier to "read" an area with those distinctions. Now, all the roads are various shades of yellow, although it's not as bad as Google Maps has become.
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Interstates clinched: 4, 57, 275 (IN-KY-OH), 465 (IN), 640 (TN), 985
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sparker

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2655 on: September 09, 2020, 03:29:34 AM »

It's not good that Bing added it so early, but who actually uses Bing Maps?

I used to, back when the freeways were purple and the tollways were green, since it was much easier to "read" an area with those distinctions. Now, all the roads are various shades of yellow, although it's not as bad as Google Maps has become.

Sounds like Bing simply cut & pasted the McNally atlas colors (purple=freeway, chartreuse-green=toll road) but didn't follow through onto surface facilities.  Perhaps because the online maps use outlined formats for streets in order to accommodate zooming in that pastel colors like yellow are used so they don't mask ID details. 
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razorback0308

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2656 on: October 11, 2020, 09:50:55 PM »

I was surprised to see the NB lanes of the BV bypass will be asphalt instead of concrete, which would have matched the existing SB lanes. I even emailed ARDOT to confirm it as they started the asphalt.

Iím sure it was all for cost reasons, but it still seems like such an Arkansas thing to do. I canít think of many, if any interstates in Arkansas, at least, that have different surfaces on the parallel lanes of the interstate.

Oh well, at least it will be a fully functioning interstate in roughly a year from now.
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sparker

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2657 on: October 12, 2020, 08:08:27 AM »

I was surprised to see the NB lanes of the BV bypass will be asphalt instead of concrete, which would have matched the existing SB lanes. I even emailed ARDOT to confirm it as they started the asphalt.

Iím sure it was all for cost reasons, but it still seems like such an Arkansas thing to do. I canít think of many, if any interstates in Arkansas, at least, that have different surfaces on the parallel lanes of the interstate.

Oh well, at least it will be a fully functioning interstate in roughly a year from now.

Looks like AR is joining the asphalt/concrete "combo" club that has membership including WA (US 395 from Pasco to I-90) and even CA -- although much of the CA "split carriageway" types are simply one direction having been converted to asphalt while the other direction will eventually be revamped likewise in a future fiscal term.  But this I-49 segment seems like the only instance of a completely new facility on new alignment being constructed in this manner; some of the others (including the US 395 segment cited above) were the result of decisions made during the "twinning" process.
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US71

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2658 on: October 12, 2020, 09:12:42 AM »

I was surprised to see the NB lanes of the BV bypass will be asphalt instead of concrete, which would have matched the existing SB lanes. I even emailed ARDOT to confirm it as they started the asphalt.

Iím sure it was all for cost reasons, but it still seems like such an Arkansas thing to do. I canít think of many, if any interstates in Arkansas, at least, that have different surfaces on the parallel lanes of the interstate.

Oh well, at least it will be a fully functioning interstate in roughly a year from now.

Based on what I have seen, it's likely an asphalt base topped with concrete. 
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capt.ron

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2659 on: October 12, 2020, 12:39:44 PM »

I was surprised to see the NB lanes of the BV bypass will be asphalt instead of concrete, which would have matched the existing SB lanes. I even emailed ARDOT to confirm it as they started the asphalt.

Iím sure it was all for cost reasons, but it still seems like such an Arkansas thing to do. I canít think of many, if any interstates in Arkansas, at least, that have different surfaces on the parallel lanes of the interstate.

Oh well, at least it will be a fully functioning interstate in roughly a year from now.
The new lanes of US 67 by Jacksonville featured the same technique but the asphalt is for the base. They will have a thick layer of concrete on top of the asphalt.
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bwana39

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2660 on: October 12, 2020, 01:14:10 PM »

I was surprised to see the NB lanes of the BV bypass will be asphalt instead of concrete, which would have matched the existing SB lanes. I even emailed ARDOT to confirm it as they started the asphalt.

Iím sure it was all for cost reasons, but it still seems like such an Arkansas thing to do. I canít think of many, if any interstates in Arkansas, at least, that have different surfaces on the parallel lanes of the interstate.

Oh well, at least it will be a fully functioning interstate in roughly a year from now.
The new lanes of US 67 by Jacksonville featured the same technique but the asphalt is for the base. They will have a thick layer of concrete on top of the asphalt.

Have seen this in Texas as well. It is supposed to prevent the concrete from floating when the earth becomes saturated.
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kphoger

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2661 on: October 12, 2020, 01:40:25 PM »

So it's basically like whitetopping from Day 1, then?  Or is there a fundamental difference?
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Road Hog

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2662 on: October 12, 2020, 05:04:08 PM »

I was surprised to see the NB lanes of the BV bypass will be asphalt instead of concrete, which would have matched the existing SB lanes. I even emailed ARDOT to confirm it as they started the asphalt.

Iím sure it was all for cost reasons, but it still seems like such an Arkansas thing to do. I canít think of many, if any interstates in Arkansas, at least, that have different surfaces on the parallel lanes of the interstate.

Oh well, at least it will be a fully functioning interstate in roughly a year from now.

Based on what I have seen, it's likely an asphalt base topped with concrete.
That should be correct. Once theyíre ready to lay concrete, theyíll put in the rebar first. Then theyíll bring in the Gomaco and start putting in the final surface.
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J N Winkler

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2663 on: October 12, 2020, 07:11:22 PM »

So it's basically like whitetopping from Day 1, then?  Or is there a fundamental difference?

The latter--it is full-depth concrete that goes on top of the base.
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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2664 on: October 12, 2020, 09:35:46 PM »

So it's basically like whitetopping from Day 1, then?  Or is there a fundamental difference?

The latter--it is full-depth concrete that goes on top of the base.

For Arkansas that should be an 18" thick slab.
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MikieTimT

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2665 on: October 13, 2020, 08:41:24 PM »

Just drove AR-549 2 directions for a job today.  They are laying the concrete.  Didn't see any asphalt up to the southern AR-72 exit.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2020, 08:43:37 PM by MikieTimT »
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US71

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2666 on: October 14, 2020, 03:28:13 PM »

Just drove AR-549 2 directions for a job today.  They are laying the concrete.  Didn't see any asphalt up to the southern AR-72 exit.

North of CR 34 (the current end)  there was asphalt back in July, but probably just the base and not the driving surface.



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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2667 on: October 24, 2020, 01:21:35 AM »

Question, as I don't know how these things work:

In the next (hopefully) year or two when the Bella Vista Bypass is finished, would the AHTD change the sign at I-40 to I-49 from "Alma Fayetteville" (which is what I remember it being) to "Fayetteville Kansas City" given the new direct path from metro Fort Smith to one of America's largest metro areas?  Or would KC be too far away for them to do that?  I know that the current U S 67 signage had the mileage to St. Louis somewhere in the NLR limits or just above (Sherwood, Jacksonville) as I recall, so I'd guess there'll be a "Kansas City 200 miles" sign somewhere on Arkansas I-49 northbound above Alma.

Thank you in advance. ">)
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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2668 on: October 24, 2020, 08:05:54 AM »

Question, as I don't know how these things work:

In the next (hopefully) year or two when the Bella Vista Bypass is finished, would the AHTD change the sign at I-40 to I-49 from "Alma Fayetteville" (which is what I remember it being) to "Fayetteville Kansas City" given the new direct path from metro Fort Smith to one of America's largest metro areas?  Or would KC be too far away for them to do that?  I know that the current U S 67 signage had the mileage to St. Louis somewhere in the NLR limits or just above (Sherwood, Jacksonville) as I recall, so I'd guess there'll be a "Kansas City 200 miles" sign somewhere on Arkansas I-49 northbound above Alma.

Thank you in advance. ">)

Wouldn't be a bit surprised to see Joplin show up as a control city for NB I-49 either from the I-40 junction or some other point in NWA.  If limited to 2 control cities on a BGS pull-through, it's possible that from I-40 the controls would be "Fayetteville/Joplin" (with KC showing up on NB I-49 mileage signs) until past Fayetteville; since most states prefer at least one in-state reference, possibly "Bentonville/Joplin" after that -- and finally "Joplin/Kansas City" once heading north from Bentonville. 
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US71

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2669 on: October 24, 2020, 09:50:02 AM »

Question, as I don't know how these things work:

In the next (hopefully) year or two when the Bella Vista Bypass is finished, would the AHTD change the sign at I-40 to I-49 from "Alma Fayetteville" (which is what I remember it being) to "Fayetteville Kansas City" given the new direct path from metro Fort Smith to one of America's largest metro areas?  Or would KC be too far away for them to do that?  I know that the current U S 67 signage had the mileage to St. Louis somewhere in the NLR limits or just above (Sherwood, Jacksonville) as I recall, so I'd guess there'll be a "Kansas City 200 miles" sign somewhere on Arkansas I-49 northbound above Alma.

Thank you in advance. ">)

Wouldn't be a bit surprised to see Joplin show up as a control city for NB I-49 either from the I-40 junction or some other point in NWA.  If limited to 2 control cities on a BGS pull-through, it's possible that from I-40 the controls would be "Fayetteville/Joplin" (with KC showing up on NB I-49 mileage signs) until past Fayetteville; since most states prefer at least one in-state reference, possibly "Bentonville/Joplin" after that -- and finally "Joplin/Kansas City" once heading north from Bentonville. 


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Tomahawkin

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2670 on: October 24, 2020, 11:36:39 AM »

If it has been signed as IH 49? would't that rouute receive federal funding for future projects? IMO that should be a high priority corridor with Wal Mart, JB Hunt and Tyson located there. 49 could be a huge economic north/south corridor from Canada (not directly but as a plan) to Texas. This alleviate travel from IH 35, which im sure gets congested in peak travel months
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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2671 on: October 24, 2020, 11:56:33 AM »

All routes apart of the National Highway System get federal funding. There hasn't been a dedicated funding source for interstate highway projects in decades, and unfortunately, the federal government seems to have little incentive to produce an infrastructure package to accelerate funding toward improving existing interstate highways (bridge replacements, rehabilitation projects, major widening on certain routes, etc.) and construction / completion of newer corridors.

With the completion of the Belle Vista Bypass, I-49 will be complete between Fort Smith, AR and Kansas City, MO, connecting to I-29 and I-35 North. The biggest, most notable gap is obviously Fort Smith to Texarkana.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2020, 12:00:43 PM by sprjus4 »
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US71

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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2672 on: October 24, 2020, 12:05:38 PM »

All routes apart of the National Highway System get federal funding. There hasn't been a dedicated funding source for interstate highway projects in decades, and unfortunately, the federal government seems to have little incentive to produce an infrastructure package to accelerate funding toward improving existing interstate highways (bridge replacements, rehabilitation projects, major widening on certain routes, etc.) and construction / completion of newer corridors.

With the completion of the Belle Vista Bypass, I-49 will be complete between Fort Smith, AR and Kansas City, MO, connecting to I-29 and I-35 North. The biggest, most notable gap is obviously Fort Smith to Texarkana.

IMO, ARDOT doesn't have a lot of incentive like Walmart/Tyson/JB Hunt breathing down their necks to get it done.
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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2673 on: October 24, 2020, 01:11:30 PM »

Thank you for the responses, all.  It seems like I remember at West Memphis the I-55 northbound signs used to say "Blytheville St Louis" as the destination rather than "Cape Girardeau", so that's also why I wondered about the potential "Kansas City" I-49 counterparts in Alma.  (Apologies, I don't have time in Google to go "drive" that route at WM to see what the signs indicate today.)
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Re: I-49 in Arkansas
« Reply #2674 on: October 24, 2020, 01:31:01 PM »

Thank you for the responses, all.  It seems like I remember at West Memphis the I-55 northbound signs used to say "Blytheville St Louis" as the destination rather than "Cape Girardeau", so that's also why I wondered about the potential "Kansas City" I-49 counterparts in Alma.  (Apologies, I don't have time in Google to go "drive" that route at WM to see what the signs indicate today.)

Streetview still has NB I-55 with Blytheville and St. Louis in West Memphis..  I don't recall Cape Girardeau being mentioned much on I-55 except on the sections to Cape from Sikeston and St. Louis.
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