Minnesota Notes

[midwesternroadguy]

The 2023—24 Official Highway map came out. Not too many additions, and some that should be there and were missed. The map did show the new alignment for US 14 around Claremont, but left out the western interchange with TH 56. Several new roundabouts in Inver Grove Heights were depicted. However, the map did not show the recent expansion of US 212 between Chaska and Cologne, the roundabouts/overpasses on US 12 In Independence, the new interchange at Trunk Highway 57 and US 52, Manning Ave./TH 36 interchange, the expansion of 371 toward Jenkins still has a poorly shown line type,and the interchange of US 169 and TH 41 is missing.  What else?

This map is not posted on line yet.  I picked up mine at MNDOT Central Office.

[Molandfreak]

and the interchange of US 169 and TH 41 is missing.

That alone is ridiculous, the interchange opened 3 years ago...

[TheHighwayMan3561]

and the interchange of US 169 and TH 41 is missing.

That alone is ridiculous, the interchange opened 3 years ago...

It's obvious they gave up on the map long ago when they straigh-up changed the background color of the interstate shields from black to red and blue while leaving the existing numerals in place, looks like total crap.

[bschultzy]

I noticed tonight that the signs on TH 100 have been replaced between TH 55 and I-694 (with exit numbers now added). But what was also installed that I don't ever remember seeing before in Minnesota were large yellow ground-mounted "RIGHT LANE EXIT ONLY AHEAD" signs throughout the auxiliary lanes on the stretch. Usually a small white "RIGHT LANE MUST EXIT" or often no signs at all denoted these sorts of things.

Apparently I was not the only one who noticed, as the Strib did a bit on this subject today. MnDOT's sometimes ambiguous job of explicity signing auxiliary lanes as "Exit Only" evidently caught up with it.

"Yes, there has been a history of late lane changes in these types of lanes," said Eric Peterson, MnDOT metro sign engineer. "They also generate frequent complaints and questions about why some lanes are not signed this way."

https://www.startribune.com/why-new-exit-only-signs-have-appeared-on-hwy-100/600280100/

I finally drove this stretch of 100 and think the new signage is more clear and effective. The exit numbers are a nice touch. Hopefully they improve some of the signage and add exit numbers south through SLP and Edina. There's way too much weaving and people missing exits in the stretch from Minnetonka Blvd. to Excelsior Blvd. If they do add exit #s on the southern half of 100, here's what I think they'd be:

Southbound
I-394 7CB
Cedar Lake Rd/Westside Dr. 7A
Minnetonka Blvd 6C
Hwy 7&25 6BA
36th St/Excelsior Blvd 5BA
50th St/Eden Ave 4
Benton Ave 3
MN62 2BA
70th St 1D
77th St 1C
I-494 1BA

Northbound
I-494 1AB
77th St 1C
70th St 1D
MN 62 2AB
50th St/Eden Ave 4
Excelsior Blvd 5A
36th St 5B
Hwy 7&25 6A (not sure what rules are for exit numbers when ramps are different in opposite directions)
Minnetonka Blvd 6C
Barry St/Cedar Lake Rd 7A
I-394 7BC

[andarcondadont]

I noticed tonight that the signs on TH 100 have been replaced between TH 55 and I-694 (with exit numbers now added). But what was also installed that I don't ever remember seeing before in Minnesota were large yellow ground-mounted "RIGHT LANE EXIT ONLY AHEAD" signs throughout the auxiliary lanes on the stretch. Usually a small white "RIGHT LANE MUST EXIT" or often no signs at all denoted these sorts of things.

Apparently I was not the only one who noticed, as the Strib did a bit on this subject today. MnDOT's sometimes ambiguous job of explicity signing auxiliary lanes as "Exit Only" evidently caught up with it.

"Yes, there has been a history of late lane changes in these types of lanes," said Eric Peterson, MnDOT metro sign engineer. "They also generate frequent complaints and questions about why some lanes are not signed this way."

https://www.startribune.com/why-new-exit-only-signs-have-appeared-on-hwy-100/600280100/

I finally drove this stretch of 100 and think the new signage is more clear and effective. The exit numbers are a nice touch. Hopefully they improve some of the signage and add exit numbers south through SLP and Edina. There's way too much weaving and people missing exits in the stretch from Minnetonka Blvd. to Excelsior Blvd. If they do add exit #s on the southern half of 100, here's what I think they'd be:

Southbound
I-394 7CB
Cedar Lake Rd/Westside Dr. 7A
Minnetonka Blvd 6C
Hwy 7&25 6BA
36th St/Excelsior Blvd 5BA
50th St/Eden Ave 4
Benton Ave 3
MN62 2BA
70th St 1D
77th St 1C
I-494 1BA

Northbound
I-494 1AB
77th St 1C
70th St 1D
MN 62 2AB
50th St/Eden Ave 4
Excelsior Blvd 5A
36th St 5B
Hwy 7&25 6A (not sure what rules are for exit numbers when ramps are different in opposite directions)
Minnetonka Blvd 6C
Barry St/Cedar Lake Rd 7A
I-394 7BC

Regarding the Northbound Hwy 7 & County 25 exit, I would presume it would be signed as Exit 6 A-B, as it is one ramp providing access to both Hwy 7 and County 25. A similar example is the exit ramp leading to County H & County 10 on Southbound I-35W.

[bschultzy]

Regarding the Northbound Hwy 7 & County 25 exit, I would presume it would be signed as Exit 6 A-B, as it is one ramp providing access to both Hwy 7 and County 25. A similar example is the exit ramp leading to County H & County 10 on Southbound I-35W.

That makes sense. Thanks!

Quote repaired.  --J N Winkler

[TheHighwayMan3561]

Corridors of Commerce funding released: https://www.keyc.com/2023/07/11/governor-walz-announces-380-million-state-grants-transportation-projects/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=snd&utm_content=keyc

Interchanges/grade separation funding:
US 14/Olmsted CSAH 44 between Byron and Rochester
TH 13/Nicollet/Quentin in Burnsville
TH 371/210 in Brainerd/Baxter
TH 9/23 in New London

Freeway conversion funding:
TH 65 in Blaine

Widening funding:
US 10 in Coon Rapids between Hanson Blvd and Round Lake Blvd
I-94 six-lane gap through Albertville and Monticello

General improvements:
US 53 in Eveleth and Virginia

[bschultzy]

Corridors of Commerce funding released: https://www.keyc.com/2023/07/11/governor-walz-announces-380-million-state-grants-transportation-projects/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=snd&utm_content=keyc

Interchanges/grade separation funding:
TH 13/Nicollet/Quentin in Burnsville

MN 13/Quentin would be Savage, correct?

[froggie]

^ Correct.  Once the current interchange at Dakota is completed, Quentin will be the first traffic signal one encounters coming from 169.

[Mdcastle]

My take is it's the Quentin to Nicollet corridor in general, AFAIK Nicollet is the only specifically identified project at this point.

The "General Improvements", to put it less obtusely, is most notably a roundabout at US 53 and Progress Park, and backage road, due to the new consolidated high school they're building in the middle of the woods between Virginia and Evelelth.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

That's not my favorite place I've ever heard of to stick a roundabout as it will go inbetween two interchanges on a 55 MPH 4-lane expressway where people driving north especially have been zoned out for the previous hour. (Yes, I know there's a stoplight at that intersection now)

[Molandfreak]

That's not my favorite place I've ever heard of to stick a roundabout as it will go inbetween two interchanges on a 55 MPH 4-lane expressway where people driving north especially have been zoned out for the previous hour. (Yes, I know there's a stoplight at that intersection now)

Unfortunately, I think this is the best they can do for a declining town like Eveleth. It's sort of like the US 212 corridor where everyone in the area seems to want a freeway built, but the tax base and traffic just aren't there to justify it. There are other things that could be done to make the roundabout less of a surprise, and certainly less of a surprise than the current traffic light is.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

That's not my favorite place I've ever heard of to stick a roundabout as it will go inbetween two interchanges on a 55 MPH 4-lane expressway where people driving north especially have been zoned out for the previous hour. (Yes, I know there's a stoplight at that intersection now)

Unfortunately, I think this is the best they can do for a declining town like Eveleth. It's sort of like the US 212 corridor where everyone in the area seems to want a freeway built, but the tax base and traffic just aren't there to justify it. There are other things that could be done to make the roundabout less of a surprise, and certainly less of a surprise than the current traffic light is.

Yeah, I mean I'm not advocating for an interchange, just unsure what the right option is.

[Molandfreak]

That's not my favorite place I've ever heard of to stick a roundabout as it will go inbetween two interchanges on a 55 MPH 4-lane expressway where people driving north especially have been zoned out for the previous hour. (Yes, I know there's a stoplight at that intersection now)

Unfortunately, I think this is the best they can do for a declining town like Eveleth. It's sort of like the US 212 corridor where everyone in the area seems to want a freeway built, but the tax base and traffic just aren't there to justify it. There are other things that could be done to make the roundabout less of a surprise, and certainly less of a surprise than the current traffic light is.

Yeah, I mean I'm not advocating for an interchange, just unsure what the right option is.

I wonder if an overpass was studied here. Seems like that combined with converting the intersections immediately north and south of Progress Parkway into reduced-conflict intersections would be a nice scenario.

[JREwing78]

The "General Improvements", to put it less obtusely, is most notably a roundabout at US 53 and Progress Park, and backage road, due to the new consolidated high school they're building in the middle of the woods between Virginia and Evelelth.

That's not my favorite place I've ever heard of to stick a roundabout as it will go inbetween two interchanges on a 55 MPH 4-lane expressway where people driving north especially have been zoned out for the previous hour. (Yes, I know there's a stoplight at that intersection now)

Unfortunately, I think this is the best they can do for a declining town like Eveleth. It's sort of like the US 212 corridor where everyone in the area seems to want a freeway built, but the tax base and traffic just aren't there to justify it. There are other things that could be done to make the roundabout less of a surprise, and certainly less of a surprise than the current traffic light is.

Yeah, I mean I'm not advocating for an interchange, just unsure what the right option is.

I wonder if an overpass was studied here. Seems like that combined with converting the intersections immediately north and south of Progress Parkway into reduced-conflict intersections would be a nice scenario.

Given MnDOT's relative generosity elsewhere, I suspect the overpass was looked at and rejected. I would suggest they look harder.

It would be one thing if US-53 wasn't built as a near-freeway mainline route throughout the area. Having stoplights on such a road is bad enough.

With numerous overpasses and high-speed interchanges already in place, putting a roundabout here just feels dumb. Worse, I suspect this one will get its fair share of folks who "didn't see" the roundabout and plow right through it.

An overpass and interchange at Bourgin Rd and Old US-53 would be ideal, with reduced-conflict intersections at other locations. Even if it's just reduced-conflict intersections throughout, that will do the job without diminishing US-53 to just a local city street. Though unlikely to receive heavy use, a pedestrian underpass under US-53 would at least give pretense of folks being able to walk to school.

[kernals12]

MnDOT has put out its options for "rethinking" I-94 between Minneapolis and St Paul

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23879188-rethinking-i-94-project-one-pagers-july-14-2023?responsive=1&title=1

I think this is just a dog and pony show before they announce they'll keep the freeway as it is with some minor improvements.

[froggie]

https://www.dot.state.mn.us/d8/projects/hwy23willmar/

Looks like MnDOT is completing a regular diamond interchange on MN 23 at CSAH 5 on the southwest side of Willmar.  Currently, only the eastbound on-ramp is what would be considered a "normal ramp".

I've asked for a PDF of the layout.

[bschultzy]

MnDOT has put out its options for "rethinking" I-94 between Minneapolis and St Paul

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23879188-rethinking-i-94-project-one-pagers-july-14-2023?responsive=1&title=1

I think this is just a dog and pony show before they announce they'll keep the freeway as it is with some minor improvements.

I'm glad this document finally came out. I know they're all alternatives at this point, but I can imagine the hardline freeway removal groups gasped when they saw the expanded 94 alternatives alongside their preferred removals. The whole situation is so difficult to fathom and I doubt much changes when the project is implemented. My guess is that the freeway stays the same but the bus shoulders are fully implemented. I would also assume that St. Anthony and Concordia Aves get a great deal of attention regarding design, speed, etc. Right now, speeding is rampant on those frontage roads and they're horrible for cars, bikes, and peds.

I have a great deal of empathy for those who were affected when the freeway was built as well as those whose life and health are impacted by it. I work at a university that sits on 94 and know the depth of hurt and harm done to the residents of Rondo. It's clear the freeway was and still is a detriment to the neighborhoods along 94.

I also don't know how viable full removal of the freeway would be. I understand induced demand and examples outside the US of successful urban freeway removals more similar to this proposal (not thinking of spur or stub removals here). But I think there's such a volume of drivers who will cause more traffic to use city streets, 694, 494, 62, 36, and 280 rather than not drive or use public transit. We love our cars.

For example, I live in a first ring suburb in the west metro and commute to that university on 94. Right now, I can drive to my office in about 25-30 minutes in the morning. Metro Transit would take about 1:20 right now. When the Green Line Extension opens, that reduces to about an hour. Unless freeway removal increases my drive time to more than public transit, I would still drive to work.

[Molandfreak]

An overpass and interchange at Bourgin Rd and Old US-53 would be ideal, with reduced-conflict intersections at other locations. Even if it's just reduced-conflict intersections throughout, that will do the job without diminishing US-53 to just a local city street. Though unlikely to receive heavy use, a pedestrian underpass under US-53 would at least give pretense of folks being able to walk to school.

I think an overpass at Progress Parkway would provide a reliable route for buses and pedestrians, and wouldn't require separate infrastructure for pedestrians to avoid a lengthy detour. The Bourgin Road intersection could even be converted to a RIRO for safe access.

I'm not totally against the idea of roundabouts on 53, but installing one in this location is a disaster waiting to happen. Replacing the lights in Virginia with roundabouts (and pedestrian tunnels) might be ok with the new bridge requiring northbound traffic to slow down.

[Molandfreak]

https://www.dot.state.mn.us/d8/projects/hwy23willmar/

Looks like MnDOT is completing a regular diamond interchange on MN 23 at CSAH 5 on the southwest side of Willmar.  Currently, only the eastbound on-ramp is what would be considered a "normal ramp".

I've asked for a PDF of the layout.

Good deal. Now Willmar won't feel like a wasteland of poorly-connected stubs for the first time in 15 years.

Does anyone know why they decided not to extend MN 40 north on CSAH 5 to reconnect with US 12 after the Willmar Wye project?

[TheHighwayMan3561]

For example, I live in a first ring suburb in the west metro and commute to that university on 94. Right now, I can drive to my office in about 25-30 minutes in the morning. Metro Transit would take about 1:20 right now. When the Green Line Extension opens, that reduces to about an hour. Unless freeway removal increases my drive time to more than public transit, I would still drive to work.

I think this outlines the most basic problem. Currently you can drive from downtown Minneapolis to downtown St. Paul in 15 minutes if traffic is a minimal factor. The idea of making it more difficult to get between the state's largest city and its state capital/second largest city to me is a valid concern that no one has asked about. There seems to be a lot of "remove it tomorrow and figure it out later".

The state seems to favor the land bridge, which some of the removal activists say is still an unacceptable solution, but I think it's the best of both worlds in this difficult situation. Even if it requires shrinking the freeway to 3 lanes each way to accommodate, it will also help the aforementioned issues on St. Anthony and Concordia.

[kernals12]

MnDOT has put out its options for "rethinking" I-94 between Minneapolis and St Paul

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23879188-rethinking-i-94-project-one-pagers-july-14-2023?responsive=1&title=1

I think this is just a dog and pony show before they announce they'll keep the freeway as it is with some minor improvements.

I'm glad this document finally came out. I know they're all alternatives at this point, but I can imagine the hardline freeway removal groups gasped when they saw the expanded 94 alternatives alongside their preferred removals. The whole situation is so difficult to fathom and I doubt much changes when the project is implemented. My guess is that the freeway stays the same but the bus shoulders are fully implemented. I would also assume that St. Anthony and Concordia Aves get a great deal of attention regarding design, speed, etc. Right now, speeding is rampant on those frontage roads and they're horrible for cars, bikes, and peds.

I have a great deal of empathy for those who were affected when the freeway was built as well as those whose life and health are impacted by it. I work at a university that sits on 94 and know the depth of hurt and harm done to the residents of Rondo. It's clear the freeway was and still is a detriment to the neighborhoods along 94.

I also don't know how viable full removal of the freeway would be. I understand induced demand and examples outside the US of successful urban freeway removals more similar to this proposal (not thinking of spur or stub removals here). But I think there's such a volume of drivers who will cause more traffic to use city streets, 694, 494, 62, 36, and 280 rather than not drive or use public transit. We love our cars.

For example, I live in a first ring suburb in the west metro and commute to that university on 94. Right now, I can drive to my office in about 25-30 minutes in the morning. Metro Transit would take about 1:20 right now. When the Green Line Extension opens, that reduces to about an hour. Unless freeway removal increases my drive time to more than public transit, I would still drive to work.

Minneapolis has experience with freeway removal when the I-35 bridge collapsed. It was not positive at all.

And I'm guessing Rondo residents use i-94 very frequently. It also serves that neighborhood by pulling traffic off of surface streets.

The barrier effect of it can be greatly reduced by adding more bridges.

[The Ghostbuster]

Any proposal that reduces traffic lanes or replaces the existing freeway with an at-grade roadway (which some alternatives do) is a no-go in my book. I would pick either Expanded Freeway alternative with a "land bridge" to cover the freeway.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

My biggest issue for a long time has been the lane drop under the Snelling overpass. If nothing else I would like that filled.

When traffic is lighter, it's moving +10 at the bare minimum east of 280.

[bschultzy]

My biggest issue for a long time has been the lane drop under the Snelling overpass. If nothing else I would like that filled.

That lane drop sucks. I also think the proximity of the WB onramp at Lexington to the offramp to Hamline needs to be reimagined. It's rough that drivers have to dodge cars exiting at Hamline *and* have to get over to continue on 94 WB as the right lane becomes exit only to Snelling.