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North Spokane Corridor - US 395 in Spokane, WA

Started by ctroadgeek, May 24, 2009, 02:18:38 PM

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pderocco

Gee, as long as they are putting roundabouts underneath overpasses, they might as well have done what Massachusetts commonly did in the old days, which is to make a large rotary that straddles the freeway, and serves the cross road and the ramps.


Bruce

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The Ghostbuster

I think the US 2 designation should've been applied to the North Spokane Corridor along with the US 395 designation. After all, 2 and 395 have been co-designated for a sufficient length through the Spokane area since 1948 (US 195 was also co-designated with US 2 between Spokane and Sandpoint, Idaho until 1969).

Bruce

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on November 17, 2023, 09:14:05 PM
I think the US 2 designation should've been applied to the North Spokane Corridor along with the US 395 designation. After all, 2 and 395 have been co-designated for a sufficient length through the Spokane area since 1948 (US 195 was also co-designated with US 2 between Spokane and Sandpoint, Idaho until 1969).

US 2 is less of a through route in the Spokane area and is better suited to staying on a major local street like Division. It isn't really associated with freeways given how short its I-90 concurrency and airport stub is; US 395, meanwhile, is largely freeway between the Tri-Cities and Ritzville.

I do wonder what will happen to the current section of US 395 north of the wye; it would probably be best to number it as a state route, maybe SR 293 or SR 297. The move will leave SR 291 as a bit of an orphan, so perhaps an extension east to Freya and north to the NSC would make sense (though Spokane would still retain control of the corridor).
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The Ghostbuster

There are two free-flow ramps connecting US 2 West with future US 395 South, and one connecting future US 395 North with US 2 East. That tell's me that a move of the US 2 designation to the North Spokane Corridor is possible, or was at least contemplated when that portion of the NSC was designed and later constructed. Though you are probably right about US 2 remaining on its existing alignment. I guess we'll all find out when the NSC is completed at the end of 2030.

jakeroot

From their blog post about the opening (here), I thought this was a pretty interesting image. For those not in the know, it's a section of the 395 freeway/NSC viaduct in front of the Spokane Community College. I don't know why this section was built before everything else, but it looks quite ominous standing on its own.

The more interesting thing is just that we are still building stuff like this. Elevated freeways are a dime a dozen here in Japan (legitimately everywhere because they save on ROW acquisition especially when built on top of existing roads), but increasingly rare in the US, especially in urban areas. It's necessitated through here because of the tight ROW and need to pass over a substantial number of roads, but I guess freeways in these kinds of areas are rarer nowadays, so you just don't see this kind of construction as often. The northern section of the 395 freeway/NSC is more what I imagine when I think of modern freeway construction; at-grade, more out of the way from urban areas, and only bridging only at specific points.


Bickendan


jakeroot

Quote from: Bickendan on November 21, 2023, 10:30:38 PM
Is that a 3x3 crosssection?

I am replying tentatively with "yes", as everything else is 3x3 and having this section be 2x2 would not be logical. Though I will concur with what I suppose is your observation, that it's not obviously 3x3 and seems pretty narrow if it is, or at the very least seems to be lacking shoulders of Interstate-quality width (obviously not a concern for this non-Interstate route).

Bobby5280

When I use the measuring tool in Google Earth on those bridge decks the roadway on each bridge is roughly 52' wide. That would leave enough room for three lanes 12' wide, plus a 10' outer shoulder and a 6' inner shoulder.

Alps

In this case specifically the narrow ROW available and constraints on both sides lead to a lot of design decisions. Wouldn't be surprised if there are utilities directly under the freeway they're trying to avoid impacting.

pderocco

This elevated part appears in some of the street view along Greene.

rte66man

Quote from: pderocco on November 09, 2023, 09:57:26 PM
Gee, as long as they are putting roundabouts underneath overpasses, they might as well have done what Massachusetts commonly did in the old days, which is to make a large rotary that straddles the freeway, and serves the cross road and the ramps.

That is how they do it in Europe. My personal favourite (since I used to drive this one) is:
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5623741,-0.4987382,1262m/data=!3m1!1e3?authuser=0&entry=ttu

Notice the mini-roundabouts included at 3 of the junction points.
When you come to a fork in the road... TAKE IT.

                                                               -Yogi Berra

vdeane

The US is moving away from high-speed rotaries and traffic circles.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

The Ghostbuster

That is likely a good thing. Roundabouts take up far less space than traffic circles anyway.

triplemultiplex

Quote from: jakeroot on November 21, 2023, 08:24:24 PM
I don't know why this section was built before everything else, but it looks quite ominous standing on its own.

Head start on reclaiming the space underneath for parking maybe?
"That's just like... your opinion, man."

Voyager

It seems this highway is really controversial on Reddit - lots of people wanting a rail corridor built there instead. I've never been to Spokane but it doesn't seem THAT walkable to begin with judging from a map view?
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Plutonic Panda

You're kidding me!? Reddit users not liking a freeway? No way.

LilianaUwU

Quote from: Plutonic Panda on December 06, 2023, 05:19:05 PM
You're kidding me!? Reddit users not liking a freeway? No way.
I was gonna say, the only thing Reddit hates more than its CEO is freeways.
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The Ghostbuster

How many of those Reddit users would have utilized a rail line had it been constructed instead of the NSC? My guess is very few would have.

Bruce

Quote from: Voyager on December 06, 2023, 05:12:57 PM
It seems this highway is really controversial on Reddit - lots of people wanting a rail corridor built there instead. I've never been to Spokane but it doesn't seem THAT walkable to begin with judging from a map view?

Spokane has a pleasant downtown, though the wide one-way streets make it harder to walk around. Riverfront Park (site of Expo 74) is a real gem and has plenty of crossings that make the Spokane River a bit less of an obstacle. Bus frequency is much better than you'd expect from a city of this size, with one BRT line now in operation and several high-frequency routes (including a ring around the city). It's got great bones and would work well for rapid transit in the future, but there's also a lot of sprawl (particularly to the north and east).

I still question the utility of the NSC at full buildout, since it's so far east that it doesn't really serve any normal commuters. It'll be handy for taking freight off Division (which needs a diet ASAP, it's a death trap), but beyond that the freeway isn't really going to be the panacea it is touted to be. Spokane's traffic problems are a joke, with or without the NSC.

The sentiment I've seen on r/spokane has been a bunch of shrugs, so I'm not seeing the supposed controversy.
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compdude787

Quote from: Bruce on December 06, 2023, 08:56:43 PM
I still question the utility of the NSC at full buildout, since it's so far east that it doesn't really serve any normal commuters. It'll be handy for taking freight off Division (which needs a diet ASAP, it's a death trap), but beyond that the freeway isn't really going to be the panacea it is touted to be. Spokane's traffic problems are a joke, with or without the NSC.

The NSC is far enough east that it affects a relatively low amount of residential neighborhoods; other than at the interchange with I-90, no houses had to be torn down, which is pretty impressive for an urban freeway. It's a good thing that the old railyard just happened to be there for them to route the freeway through.

Bruce

A plane made an emergency landing and controlled takeoff on the NSC a few days ago:

https://x.com/WSDOT_East/status/1791959410803388729
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pderocco


ErmineNotyours

Adding more fuel to the urban legend that Interstates were designed for planes to land and take off.

Henry

Quote from: ErmineNotyours on May 21, 2024, 10:46:26 PMAdding more fuel to the urban legend that Interstates were designed for planes to land and take off.
AFAIK, this is not going to be an Interstate anytime soon, although it would make a good I-x90 spur route.
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