GPS mindlessness

[SP Cook]

http://www.dailymail.com/News/TechnologyNews/201206050168

Before you follow the advice of your GPS and head down that narrow country lane, you might want to consult an old-fashioned paper map. 

Trooper B.D. Gillespie of the Welch detachment of the West Virginia State Police said the accident was reported at 1:30 a.m. The truck driver was headed to the Walmart in Big Four about 5 miles southeast of Welch on U.S. 52 when his GPS device routed him onto Airport Road, a winding, one-way road that is impassable to large trucks.

[Alps]

I looked at a map. Airport Rd. is not a one-way road. They meant that it never actually comes back out to US 52.

[mjb2002]

This story is precisely WHY I do NOT buy GPSes. And I do NOT use the GPS on my Android.

[NE2]

This shit again?

[Stratuscaster]

Right. Because no one has ever taken the wrong road using a paper map before.

I looked at a map. Airport Rd. is not a one-way road. They meant that it never actually comes back out to US 52.

Page 2 of the liked article stated "As for what happened in McDowell County, Gillespie said the road does lead to Walmart, but it wasn't suitable for the truck."

Looking at Google Maps, no. Airport Road does NOT lead to Walmart.

[NE2]

WVDOT claims it comes back out in Kimball: ftp://129.71.206.174/county_maps/McDowell_2_of_4.pdf
This looks like the east end: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=37.426965,-81.511152&spn=0.007583,0.016512&gl=us&t=m&z=17&layer=c&cbll=37.426769,-81.511209&panoid=6R76IqRcv_hmX_C0ixL7_g&cbp=12,219.52,,0,6.9

But that's somewhat past Big Four. My guess is that the satnav's data was missing part of US 52 between Welch and Big Four.

[hbelkins]

I saw where Rand McNally is coming out with a truckers' GPS.

I own and use a GPS because it's helpful to me, and because it's a roadgeek toy. However, I am more trustful of paper maps and generally use a GPS for one of two purposes:

1.) Finding a local destination or address in an unfamiliar area.

2.) Estimating travel times.

I used my GPS on my trip to Dayton on Friday. I entered the address of my hotel when I left work early that day. I knew I was going home first, but I wanted to see my estimated arrival time.

When I drove off the suggested route, the GPS kept trying to route me back onto its chosen route. At first it suggested a U-turn, then a few miles later it recommended I take some local gravel road to route me back onto the chosen route. I don't even think that gravel road is a through route, but the GPS insisted I take it anyway.

[nwi_navigator_1181]

I have a fondness for GPS, especially Garmin. In my three years of using it, they have been fairly accurate.

However, I always present this word of caution to anyone who owns one: GPS is not a substitute for human intuition and awareness. Watch what you're looking for, read the signs, and keep your maps updated when necessary.

[agentsteel53]

I've always preferred TomTom's more lackadaisical timing estimates over Garmin's super-aggressive ones. 

TomTom assumes you will do the speed limit on the freeway, and about 35 on any road that is not completely limited access, including expressways with just the occasional ranch access and a 70mph speed.

Garmin assumes you will do 85 in school zones.

the only way I've ever been able to make up time on a Garmin was driving the Alaska Highway at 110mph.

[1995hoo]

I have a fondness for GPS, especially Garmin. In my three years of using it, they have been fairly accurate.

However, I always present this word of caution to anyone who owns one: GPS is not a substitute for human intuition and awareness. Watch what you're looking for, read the signs, and keep your maps updated when necessary.

Your second paragraph refers to the sort of thing that makes me shake my head in wonder. I cannot believe how many people just blindly assume that whatever the sat-nav tells them must be accurate, especially when they're driving through an active work zone for a major construction project. The main example that comes to my mind is the Beltway here in Virginia, which is being widened and rebuilt with high occupancy/toll lanes. Until last year traffic from the Inner Loop could exit to westbound I-66 via either a left-side ramp or a later right-side ramp, but last year the left exit was closed (and is now being demolished) while the right-side exit was relocated such that it comes up a few hundred feet earlier than it used to. I regularly see out-of-area drivers slowing down big-time in the left lane, presumably because they're looking for the left exit their sat-nav said to use (never mind the orange sign a mile earlier that says the left exit is CLOSED), and I regularly then see those drivers cutting over to the right to try to take the old right-side exit....but of course if they rely on the sat-nav they'll miss that one too because they'll be looking to exit too late. You have to read the damn signs and too many people just don't do it. It seems to me that when you're driving through a massive construction project like that, it should be self-evident that there may be changes to the road layout and that you have to pay attention. I guess the people who blindly follow the sat-nav are also the ones who drive along yapping on their handheld mobile phones and the like.

With all that said, I really like having the built-in sat-nav in my Acura for use on long trips even when I already know the way. I find it useful the way it gives me estimated time and distance to the destination and how it updates that information when I go a different way (assuming, of course, it recalculates for the actual route I intend to use). It can get annoying when the woman's voice starts saying "make a U-turn if possible," but the solution to that is easy enough–turn off the voice-guidance.

[huskeroadgeek]

I have a fondness for GPS, especially Garmin. In my three years of using it, they have been fairly accurate.

However, I always present this word of caution to anyone who owns one: GPS is not a substitute for human intuition and awareness. Watch what you're looking for, read the signs, and keep your maps updated when necessary.

The good thing is that roadgeeks like us know this. The bad thing is that many other people do not. It amazes me how these days some people rely so much on their GPS or other routing program that they seem to take leave of common sense. I think of the story last year of the woman in the Seattle area who drove her rental car into a lake because she said that was the directions the GPS gave her.
I think most routing programs have improved to the point where they don't do this stuff anymore, but I remember in the past that sometimes the route they would provide would tell you do nonsensical things like get off on an interstate exit, follow a frontage road or other nearby parallel road for awhile, and then get back on the interstate at another exit.
GPS units and online routing programs do have their usefulness, but to me they take some of the fun out of roadtripping and have allowed people to become disconnected from their surroundings in between their starting point and their destination. Too many people these days just print out their online directions or take their GPS along and just go on autopilot and are not really aware of where they are going in between.

[DBrim]

I've always preferred TomTom's more lackadaisical timing estimates over Garmin's super-aggressive ones. 

TomTom assumes you will do the speed limit on the freeway, and about 35 on any road that is not completely limited access, including expressways with just the occasional ranch access and a 70mph speed.

Garmin assumes you will do 85 in school zones.

the only way I've ever been able to make up time on a Garmin was driving the Alaska Highway at 110mph.

It's more that Garmin has no concept of traffic lights/stop signs.  I usually pick up a few minutes when I take freeways, but lose time whenever I have to hit a traffic light.

When coming from west of Boston, the proper route to take to get to my place is 95 north, to 1 north, to 62.

My garmin's suggestion:
95 north, to 1 SOUTH, U-turn on 129 east offramp (to 1 north), then BACK TO 95 NORTH, to 62 (95 to 62 adds two more traffic lights as opposed to 1).  It's pretty impressively addled.

[Stratuscaster]

Just did a trip from Warrenville, IL out to Auburn Hills, MI and back with my Garmin nuvi 1100. Not an issue at all. Now, having said that, it ain't perfect. One thing that it did do that was odd was on the trip back on I-80/94. It was telling me to take the ramp for I-94 W/IL-394 S - I figured it was going to take me up I-94 to I-290 and out to I-88 and home. (Of course, I could have checked the route - but I didn't and most folks won't either. Plus, I know how to get home from there anyway - I didn't NEED the GPS.)

Once I got on the ramp, it then told me to get back on to I-80 W. For whatever reason, the Garmin software/maps "thinks" that using the I-94/IL-294 slip ramp and merging back onto I-80 is faster than just staying in the mainline lanes. A quirk to be sure - I went ahead and submitted it to Garmin so it can be corrected in a future map update. (This was with the latest map update - 2012.20 I think? I'll have to check.)

ETA with the Garmin is usually pretty good in my experience. It was spot-on during this last trip.

Used a TomTom ONE 130S for a bit in the past - it had a bigger issue. It had no idea how to process an address like "2S771 Main Street" - simply could not deal with alphanumeric addresses. A $60 update fixes that - but when I can buy a refurb GPS for $60 and get the update included...and then figure there are a LOT of consumers that won't even bother to check for an update, let alone pay for one...it's sets the stage for failure.

(In kinda-sorta related news, Apple has dropped Google Maps in iOS 6 for it's own mapping solution that now provides turn-by-turn directions. Part of the software code is licensed from TomTom. And, in the screen shots I saw for California - the state route markers were  green spade California route markers.)

[agentsteel53]

the Tomtom has a couple of mindless features when it comes to off-ramps.

one is that sometimes it combines signs that one sees.  for example, on I-805 south at I-8, there is a butterfly gantry with two signs: "I-8 east, El Centro" and "I-8 west, beaches".  The Tomtom tells you take the ramp for "I-8 west, El Centro".  No, I am not in Yuma.

the second quirk, which has caused me to get lost numerous times, is when a ramp splits in two very quickly after exiting.  for example, at I believe this was loop 101 at loop 202 somewhere in the Phoenix area, a gantry will again show a pair of signs, 202 west and 202 east.  I do not remember the control cities.  The Tomtom will tell you to take 202 east, just to get on the off-ramp, and then immediately (with literally 35 yards of warning!) tell you to take the split to 202 west... once you've already committed to the 202 east lane. 

the first bug is just a quirk, as I can tell "okay, from this information I can extrapolate that I am to take the 8 ramp and we'll work from there", but the second one is - until a literally last-second switch, telling you incorrect information. 

[Stratuscaster]

I believe I encountered that as well with the TomTom.

The higher-end Garmins have a feature that leaves the map and shows you an image of the BGS' and lane configuration, with an arrow to direct you into the 'correct' lane. Of course, that's only as good as the data they have - but it's a good feature when dealing with things like split ramps. The refurb Garmin 1390LMT I just ordered has that feature. (Wal-Mart - $80 ship-to-store - with lifetime maps and free (ad-supported) traffic - and Bluetooth so I can go hands-free with my phone.)

[nwi_navigator_1181]

Just did a trip from Warrenville, IL out to Auburn Hills, MI and back with my Garmin nuvi 1100. Not an issue at all. Now, having said that, it ain't perfect. One thing that it did do that was odd was on the trip back on I-80/94. It was telling me to take the ramp for I-94 W/IL-394 S - I figured it was going to take me up I-94 to I-290 and out to I-88 and home. (Of course, I could have checked the route - but I didn't and most folks won't either. Plus, I know how to get home from there anyway - I didn't NEED the GPS.)

Once I got on the ramp, it then told me to get back on to I-80 W. For whatever reason, the Garmin software/maps "thinks" that using the I-94/IL-294 slip ramp and merging back onto I-80 is faster than just staying in the mainline lanes. A quirk to be sure - I went ahead and submitted it to Garmin so it can be corrected in a future map update. (This was with the latest map update - 2012.20 I think? I'll have to check.)

Emphasis mine.

I had similar routing issues, oddly enough, not too far from your anomaly. Taking I-94 east toward Indiana, the GPS would tell me to take the exit to Torrence Ave. (Illinois 83), only to merge back onto I-80/94 East. I saw what it was doing, but...the slip ramp is designed mainly for traffic entering from Illinois 394 and traffic looking to exit onto Torrence, not necessarily for through traffic.

An even crazier one was when I was driving toward Minnesota via the Northwest/Jane Addams Tollway (I-90). The GPS told me to take the ramp to I-290 and keep left to re-enter I-90 west. The worst thing about this instance is that it requires a toll to re-enter the main line (the C/D ramp was built with traffic entering from I-290/Illinois 53 in mind). I know this road like the back of my hand, so I knew better.

Thankfully, both issues have been corrected rather quickly and is still right as of this map update, which is actually 2013.10.

As for Garmin and ETA's, I get a different feeling when it comes to timing. I get the feeling that they inflate the arrival time, correcting itself as I drive. The longer I have it and use it on my commute, the more it seems to fine tune itself. As for Tom Tom, I had one and it was way too glitch prone to make it worth my time. From what I hear, they still are.

When the price is right, consider the Nuvi 3490LMT. It's pretty expensive (hence why I said when the price is right), but it has a new feature where they take spaghetti junctions into account. In complicated junctions, they show an overhead view with the purple arrows telling you where to go and showing you the next move when that ramp splits. Very effective and something to consider...

[Mapmikey]

Virginia has taken to posting signs at places where GPS systems are apparently routing truck drivers on short-cuts that are not suitable for trucks.  The signs warn drivers not to follow GPS routing over route X.

I've seen at least 3 locations this has been done.

Mapmikey

[froggie]

Is VDOT specifically referencing GPS devices on those signs or are they using their more general (and more common) "Route Not Suitable For Large Trucks" (or something similar)?

[1995hoo]

....

the second quirk, which has caused me to get lost numerous times, is when a ramp splits in two very quickly after exiting.  for example, at I believe this was loop 101 at loop 202 somewhere in the Phoenix area, a gantry will again show a pair of signs, 202 west and 202 east.  I do not remember the control cities.  The Tomtom will tell you to take 202 east, just to get on the off-ramp, and then immediately (with literally 35 yards of warning!) tell you to take the split to 202 west... once you've already committed to the 202 east lane. 

.... 

Mine sometimes treats medians strangely. When I turn from Van Dorn Street near my house onto the on-ramp to the Beltway, it will say "next left turn, then immediate slight right turn" when all I have to do is turn left. I've surmised that the reason is that all the mapping services, including the one Alpine used to build the Acura Navigation maps database, shows the ramp's median there as ending shortly before the intersection with Van Dorn (it actually doesn't), so apparently the weird "immediate slight right turn" is the system's way of telling you to turn left and then stay to the right of the median. In my mind a better question is why the programmers feel that people need to be told to stay to the right of a median like that.

Virginia has taken to posting signs at places where GPS systems are apparently routing truck drivers on short-cuts that are not suitable for trucks.  The signs warn drivers not to follow GPS routing over route X.

I've seen at least 3 locations this has been done.

Mapmikey

I have not yet seen this, but two locations that cry out for it are in Charlottesville–University Avenue past the Corner (the infamous railroad bridge with the 10-foot clearance) and perhaps Emmet Street where it passes under McCormick Road. I'll have to keep my eyes peeled next time I'm down there.

[agentsteel53]

I saw a 'do not listen to your GPS' sign in Tennessee in a construction zone on TN-66 in Gatlinburg in 2010.

another odd thing my TomTom does is at some (but not all!  I haven't figured out why) freeway splits it tells me to take the leftbound lanes.  for example, I-5 south at CA-170, it will tell me to stay on I-5 to get through Los Angeles.  But at the 134, it does not tell me anything.

[1995hoo]

I saw a 'do not listen to your GPS' sign in Tennessee in a construction zone on TN-66 in Gatlinburg in 2010.

another odd thing my TomTom does is at some (but not all!  I haven't figured out why) freeway splits it tells me to take the leftbound lanes.  for example, I-5 south at CA-170, it will tell me to stay on I-5 to get through Los Angeles.  But at the 134, it does not tell me anything.

I found something peculiar on mine on our last trip to Florida back in December. Normally when I encounter a split involving restricted lanes (be they HOV, bus, reversible, whatever) it understandably uses the conservative path of directing me to an unrestricted lane or telling me to go a different way. For example, it won't route me onto a road that may be HOV-restricted, even during non-HOV hours. On our Florida trip, I'd be approaching a toll plaza where cash-payers exit to the right and SunPass users go through ORT lanes. At the first toll plaza, the sat-nav directed me to stay right for the cash lanes, an instruction I promptly ignored because I have a SunPass. What was odd about it was that then at every subsequent toll plaza that had the ORT setup it told me to keep LEFT to go through the SunPass lanes. I found it rather odd that it wouldn't stick to the conservative routing, since after all it has no way of knowing whether you have a transponder. I wonder if it has some sort of flag in the software that gets tripped if it detects you used the ORT lanes. I'll keep my eyes on it when we use some of those same roads next week. I haven't purchased the latest software update and I doubt I will this year, so I'll be interested in seeing whether (a) it defaults back to the cash lanes and (b) it then switches to the ORT lanes after I use them.

Mine also gets confused on roads with express/local configurations; the one that comes to mind is I-270 in Maryland. Even if we're heading to somewhere farther away, such as Pittsburgh (our destination last time we went past the end of I-270), it will have me start in the express carriageway and then it will tell me to exit into the local carriageway even though we're going way beyond the end of the express/local setup. There doesn't seem to be any rationale nor common sense to how it decides when to tell me to change over. I'd understand if it defaulted to the local carriageway simply under the principle of cautious guidance (for example, the sat-nav doesn't know how much gas you have in the tank), but it doesn't do that.

[vdeane]

Even that explanation doesn't make sense with I-270, since there are crossovers between every single exit.  Btw, my Dad's did the exact same thing when we went to DC.  It also acted odd around Williamsport; heading south, we went on I-180 and took I-80 back to US 15; heading north, we just stayed on 15.  It also through a fit on I-390 because it was restricted to one carriageway on a section where the carriageways are 1/4 mile apart.

[cpzilliacus]

Virginia has taken to posting signs at places where GPS systems are apparently routing truck drivers on short-cuts that are not suitable for trucks.  The signs warn drivers not to follow GPS routing over route X.

I've seen at least 3 locations this has been done.

Mapmikey

These days, I frequently see large trucks on the federal part of the Baltimore-Washington Parkway, which is maintained by the National Park Service and patrolled by the U.S. Park Police. All entrances are posted "NO TRUCKS" or "COMMERCIAL VEHICLES EXCLUDED," even though the Park Police don't mind trucks as large as dually pickup trucks and vans, even with commercial markings.

I am pretty confident that the large trucks are led onto the B-W Parkway by GPS units, since experienced truckers (except for those driving trucks with U.S. Government registration plates, which have always been allowed) know better and know that "NO TRUCKS" means them.  Fortunately, the overpasses on this parkway are high enough to accommodate trucks, though if the Park Police observe them, they do get stopped and issued a federal traffic ticket. 

[mightyace]

I saw a 'do not listen to your GPS' sign in Tennessee in a construction zone on TN-66 in Gatlinburg in 2010.

There has also been one at TN-66/US 431/US 411 junction in Sevierville on TN-66/US 431 north.

Fan materials for Bristol say to use their directions and not the GPS.  This is in part because of the special traffic patterns around the race.

[ftballfan]

I have a TomTom and it doesn't recognize Michigan Left turnarounds (especially on M-45 west of Grand Rapids).