I-781 (Fort Drum Connector) Update

[vdeane]

The last overhead gantries were installed in August.  The other posts were in place months before the Watertown meet last year.  All they need to do is install the signs.

[machias]

My guesstimate for a week to install the signs at the I-81/I-781 interchange was because there are a lot of overhead panels involved with the work and with the current weather conditions and required lane closures and the like, it might be more challenging than when they should have done this work in the warmer months.

The big question is, will they put up a new "Canada 25" mileage sign beyond the I-81/I-781 NB interchange. Back in '86 there was a sign installed that said "1000 Islands Bridge 22 / Canada 25" but was then removed when the newer non-button copy signs were installed (maybe '96 or so). I had contacted R7 about the removal and non-replacement of the post-interchange mileage signs and they put that "Canada 25" sign up. It came down with the interchange construction. I wonder if a new one will replace it.

[machias]

Just went by yesterday.



This Jct plat is WAY oversized.



The sign from earlier.  This doesn't conform to the boxed street name specs... also, note the car to the right of the cones (not the one parked by the speed limit sign).  I don't know what it is, but it got on I-781 west right after I took this despite it not being opened (though it looks like all they need to do is uncover the US 11 signs and install the I-81 signs... it's striped and everything, and construction vehicles are already using it to bypass NY 342).

I heard back from R7.  The covered sign says "Watertown / Arsenal St / Canada", where the Arsenal St is smaller and boxed like Downtown shown in the picture above.  They decided on the box instead of parenthesis when comparing designs.

I appreciate that they're trying to distinguish Arsenal St from Downtown when ending up with Watertown as a control destination on both signs (which goes against MUTCD) and I understand what they're trying to do, but I think an R2 approach might have worked better --

Downtown
Watertown
(on the left hand panel)

and

To Arsenal St
Watertown
(on the right hand panel)

[vdeane]

Finally some good news!
http://www.watertowndailytimes.com/article/20121205/NEWS09/712059721

Now I have to decide: do I want to spend the gas it would take to get to Watertown and back?  Time's not a consideration here (I'm bored), but money is.

[cu2010]

Now with video!

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Fort-Drums-Connector-Highway-Opens-Thursday-182239731.html

Interestingly, the exit from I-781 to US11 is labelled as "Exit 4"...

[rickmastfan67]

Now with video!

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Fort-Drums-Connector-Highway-Opens-Thursday-182239731.html

And in that video, they showed a BYS that clearly states that I-781 ends @ US-11.  Should make it safer to "clinch" so you don't have to deal with the guards.

[Alex]

Now with video!

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Fort-Drums-Connector-Highway-Opens-Thursday-182239731.html

And in that video, they showed a BYS that clearly states that I-781 ends @ US-11.  Should make it safer to "clinch" so you don't have to deal with the guards.

Good to know, I would have called it good at the interchange ahead of it either way. If I can see it with my eyes in the distance, it is good enough for me to consider it clinched. Same goes for me on roads that end at a customs station.

If anyone photographs it, may I request a few pics for Interstate-Guide?

[Jim]

Nice.  I'll submit a CHM update as soon as I can gather all of the information about the new exit numbers.  Is it 48A on I-81?  Is there an exit number for I-781 where it ends at I-81?  Any other exits between there and the "Exit 4" at US 11?

[vdeane]

Now with video!

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Fort-Drums-Connector-Highway-Opens-Thursday-182239731.html

And in that video, they showed a BYS that clearly states that I-781 ends @ US-11.  Should make it safer to "clinch" so you don't have to deal with the guards.

Good to know, I would have called it good at the interchange ahead of it either way. If I can see it with my eyes in the distance, it is good enough for me to consider it clinched. Same goes for me on roads that end at a customs station.

If anyone photographs it, may I request a few pics for Interstate-Guide?

I'll be driving down there on 12/16 and should have a bunch of pictures you can use.

Nice.  I'll submit a CHM update as soon as I can gather all of the information about the new exit numbers.  Is it 48A on I-81?  Is there an exit number for I-781 where it ends at I-81?  Any other exits between there and the "Exit 4" at US 11?

The plans said 48A from I-81, 1 from I-781 to I-81, 2 for US 11, and 3 for Fort Drum; there's nothing in between.  Given that we know that US 11 is actually 4 and that Fort Drum is not numbered, I'm not sure if we can trust the other numbers either.  We'll have to wait for someone to get sign pictures.

[oscar]

Now with video!

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Fort-Drums-Connector-Highway-Opens-Thursday-182239731.html

And in that video, they showed a BYS that clearly states that I-781 ends @ US-11.  Should make it safer to "clinch" so you don't have to deal with the guards.

Not so clear to me -- the BYS says "I-781 ends -- Route US 11 traffic next exit 1/4 mile".  Doesn't specify whether the end is at the US 11 interchange, or just east of it at the Fort Drum main gate. though the BGS at the US 11 exit doesn't say that I-781 continues beyond that point, either.  If the BYS had said "I-781 ends at US 11" that'd be clear enough, but it doesn't.

I'd be curious whether there are any I-781 reference markers east of US 11, though the gap between US 11 and the Fort Drum gate might be short enough that there will be no markers no matter what if any route number is assigned to that gap.  (What's the normal spacing between NYSDOT reference markers -- tenth-mile, or more than that?) 

As I've suggested before, someone could venture into that gap armed with a legitimate reason to enter the base (maybe not on weekends, if facilities open to civilians are open only during the week).   Or you could just plan on taking the U-turn opportunity the video indicates is available just before the gate.  Even if neither works, and you get politely turned back, you'll still have a chance to check out any reference markers, etc. between US 11 and the gate.  Fort Drum does allow civilian visitors, though they need to get permission (probably at an adjacent visitor center, typical for military bases) before continuing past the gate area.

But no photos of the gate area, at least heading toward the base, so we'll have to take your word on what you find or don't find.

[vdeane]

There's an end I-781 shield just past the bridge.  Haven't gotten a chance to get a picture of it on my last few trips up US 11 though.

[machias]

It appears that I-781 uses mile based exit numbers!

[Roadgeek Adam]

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Interstate-781-Opens-To-Rave-Reviews-182434021.html

This at least shows a sign for 4, can't say for any others though.

[machias]

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Interstate-781-Opens-To-Rave-Reviews-182434021.html

This at least shows a sign for 4, can't say for any others though.

YNN has a video of coverage as well, showing the backs of the signs at the I-781/I-81 interchange and there are definitely exit tabs for the I-81 exits.    My guess is Exits 1 A-B.

[Alps]

Now with video!

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Fort-Drums-Connector-Highway-Opens-Thursday-182239731.html

And in that video, they showed a BYS that clearly states that I-781 ends @ US-11.  Should make it safer to "clinch" so you don't have to deal with the guards.

Good to know, I would have called it good at the interchange ahead of it either way. If I can see it with my eyes in the distance, it is good enough for me to consider it clinched. Same goes for me on roads that end at a customs station.

If anyone photographs it, may I request a few pics for Interstate-Guide?

I'll be driving down there on 12/16 and should have a bunch of pictures you can use.

That seems to be The Date. I may have to make my way up, but that's in the future. As for the end of the route, I would plan to use the U-turn just before the base. They may not be happy with it, but I guarantee you they see plenty of people using it because they're not familiar with the road.

[agentsteel53]

They may not be happy with it, but I guarantee you they see plenty of people using it because they're not familiar with the road.

how many show up in groups of 12 and start photographing the terminus?

[machias]

http://www.wwnytv.com/news/local/Interstate-781-Opens-To-Rave-Reviews-182434021.html

This at least shows a sign for 4, can't say for any others though.

YNN has a video of coverage as well, showing the backs of the signs at the I-781/I-81 interchange and there are definitely exit tabs for the I-81 exits.    My guess is Exits 1 A-B.

My guess was wrong, a video on YouTube shows Exits 1 N-S.  Also, the BEGIN 781 marker is right at the US 11 bridge from what I can tell.

[rickmastfan67]

My guess was wrong, a video on YouTube shows Exits 1 N-S.  Also, the BEGIN 781 marker is right at the US 11 bridge from what I can tell.

Here's that video:

[vdeane]

Here's a good question: what's with the 45 mph limits on either end of the road?  On the west end, there should be no reduction, and on the east end, the reduction should happen at the bridge, not half a mile before US 11.

[cu2010]

The state needs money, silly.  If they can't put a toll on the road, they'll just get everyone with their artificially low speed limits instead! 

[machias]

Here's a good question: what's with the 45 mph limits on either end of the road?  On the west end, there should be no reduction, and on the east end, the reduction should happen at the bridge, not half a mile before US 11.

I was wondering the same thing, but as cu2012 said, it probably has to do with revenue generation.

I noticed in the video that mileposts and NYSDOT reference markers have not been installed as of yet.

[froggie]

'Course, those of us who are active duty don't have that "need to turn around" issue...

[vdeane]

This story doesn't add anything new, but is noteworthy because the photo was taken during a roadmeet: http://www.northcountrypublicradio.org/news/story/21021/20121206/i-781-to-fort-drum-opens

[hbelkins]

What's the white stuff on the pavement? Brine? Had they pretreated in anticipation of snow?

[vdeane]

Probably road salt.  Roads in upstate NY get COVERED with it in the winter, such that cars actually drive on road salt and not asphalt during the winter months.  Plus, right after Thanksgiving, the infamous Lake Ontario Snowbelt got six inches of snow within a few hours.  Going back to Clarkson, I was one of the last cars up I-81 north before it was closed; southbound was closed already and I must have passed at least 30 cars in the ditch within an hour.  The storm wasn't even unusual, it just happened to be the first storm before drivers remember what snow is.