California 1973

[Ingsoc75]

December 1973: California lowers it's speed limit from 70 mph to 65 mph during the oil embargo.

[Desert Man]

Then came the national speed limit to 55 mph ("saves gas, saves lives") the following year (1974) and the law remained in effect until 1996, when US congress decided states should set their own speed limits. Speed laws don't always work, because some drivers continue to speed and still disregard safety laws and driving etiquette.

[Big John]

^^ There was a 1986 amendment to allow 65 MPH for "rural Interstates".

[MarkF]

That must have been referring to I-5 through Camp Pendleton.  I think it was less than a year earlier that it was raised to 70 through there.

[Brandon]

Then came the national speed limit to 55 mph ("saves gas, saves lives") the following year (1974) and the law remained in effect until 1996, when US congress decided states should set their own speed limits. Speed laws don't always work, because some drivers continue to speed and still disregard safety laws and driving etiquette.

Speed laws like the 55 mph NMSL don't work as they're an artificially low speed limit for a road built for 70-75 mph traffic.  I will contend that the NMSL was one of the worst things to ever happen to traffic as it taught a lot of people that the speed limit really means nothing.

[PHLBOS]

Then came the national speed limit to 55 mph ("saves gas, saves lives") the following year (1974) and the law remained in effect until 1996, when US congress decided states should set their own speed limits. Speed laws don't always work, because some drivers continue to speed and still disregard safety laws and driving etiquette.

Additionally, car transmissions have long since advanced.  Back then, most transmissions were 3 or 4 speeds at the most (GM had just phased out its 2-speed Powerglide automatic at the time).

Overdrive transmissions (which allowed engines to rev at lower RPMs at highway speeds, and use less fuel) that started showing up on cars in the early 1980s made the NSL as a fuel-saving measure obsolete (my 2007 Mustang V6 with the 5-speed automatic gets its best fuel economy when averaging 72 mph).  Over time, 5, 6 and even 8-speed transmissions become available & more common in the market.

^^ There was a 1986 amendment to allow 65 MPH for "rural Interstates".

I normally don't nitpick about a minor post typo but I have to in this case because the difference is significant from a historical perspective.

The amendment that you speak of was part of an overall highway bill (which included Federal funding for Boston's Big Dig) that was passed in 1987.  That was the year that the Democrats regained control of the US Senate and used their then-newly-minted majority to approve the bill and override President Reagan's veto.  He vetoed it due to the large ($2.5 billion back then) pricetag of the Big Dig. 

The provision in the bill to raise the NSL to 65 on rural Interstates was the Democrat's way of throwing the Republican President a bone to sign the bill (Reagan wanted the NSL gone completely but such required an act of Congress (i.e. no Executive Order)). 
______________________________________

BTW, the NSL was originally set at 50 (Fifty is Thrifty) but raised to 55 shortly thereafter.

[Ingsoc75]

The 50 mph was never a federally mandated law. Many states adopted it before NMSL was signed in January 1973.

[Brandon]

The 50 mph was never a federally mandated law. Many states adopted it before NMSL was signed in January 1973.

It came close to being, however.  The original idea was 50 mph for cars and 55 mph for trucks.  Yes, a higher truck speed limit.  The final law made it 55 mph for all vehicles.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Maximum_Speed_Law

There attempts to increase the limit as early as 1974.  By 1981, 33 state legislatures debated measures in opposition to the NMSL.  http://www.nytimes.com/1982/12/26/travel/practical-traveler-the-55-mph-speed-limit.html

It was finally repealed in 1995.

[Ingsoc75]

I remember there was also talk at the federal level of allowing trucks to go 60 mph and cars 50 mph and 55 mph was thought of a compromise.

[hm insulators]

Then came the national speed limit to 55 mph ("saves gas, saves lives") the following year (1974) and the law remained in effect until 1996, when US congress decided states should set their own speed limits. Speed laws don't always work, because some drivers continue to speed and still disregard safety laws and driving etiquette.

Speed laws like the 55 mph NMSL don't work as they're an artificially low speed limit for a road built for 70-75 mph traffic.  I will contend that the NMSL was one of the worst things to ever happen to traffic as it taught a lot of people that the speed limit really means nothing.

I think the current disdain for traffic laws stemmed from the NMSL. Right from the start, it became an ongoing battle between the motorists who were determined to drive the old higher speeds (if not faster) and the cops who were equally determined to enforce the new law. (And of course government entities loved the revenue all those speeding tickets brought in. ) Citizens' Band radios became a huge fad (remember those?) and songs like "Convoy" and "I Can't Drive 55" climbed the Billboard pop music charts. And ad campaigns like "55 Saves Lives" worked about as well as "Just Say No"--falling on deaf ears.

[Thunderbyrd316]

   It was not just government that liked those ridiculously low speed limits. The insurance lobby loved them because those tickets issued for driving at perfectly safe and reasonable speeds gave insurance companies a perfect excuse to jack up rates on otherwise perfectly safe drivers.

   And yes, I also agree that this ridiculous law had some VERY bad consequences. It "taught" people that if the speed limit on freeways and other open, rural highways is 10 - 15 m.p.h. below what is actually safe then that 25 m.p.h. speed limit on neighborhood residential streets is probably also 10 - 15 m.p.h. too slow and it is perfectly acceptable to drive at 10 - 15 m.p.h. (or more) over ALL posted speed limits.

   I would further argue that the implications of this law went beyond just driving behavior and really "taught" (especially the young people who grew up under it) that the rule of law in general is a joke and thus had a corrosive effect on respect for the rule of law in general.

[mariethefoxy]

25 is too low for residential streets, especially straight ones without any twists and turns, should be 30-35.

[kkt]

25 is too low for residential streets, especially straight ones without any twists and turns, should be 30-35.

Based on what?  The fatality rate for pedestrians in car-pedestrian accidents goes up alarmingly when speeds are over about 25 mph.  These are city streets, not freeways.  There are kids, pets, etc., who enter the road unexpectedly.

[noelbotevera]

25 is too low for residential streets, especially straight ones without any twists and turns, should be 30-35.

Oh really?

[TheHighwayMan3561]

25 seems fine to me. I know speed limits for the most part are arbitrarily frowned on by most of society as being too low regardless of whether or not that may be true in a particular instance (and the people who follow them or stick close to them are spit on), but they're not always set at the wrong speed.

[Ingsoc75]

I often wonder if NMSL never happened, many states east of the Mississippi would still have 65 day/55 night on two lane roads.

After NMSL repeal, Florida seems to be the only state east of the Mississippi to post speeds higher than 55 on 2 lane roads.

[kendancy66]

That must have been referring to I-5 through Camp Pendleton.  I think it was less than a year earlier that it was raised to 70 through there.

The newspaper caption says San Diego freeway in Orange County. Camp Pendleton is in San Diego County. They are probably talking about I-5 from El Toro South to San Clemente

[Thunderbyrd316]

25 is too low for residential streets, especially straight ones without any twists and turns, should be 30-35.

   While I would agree that there are some 4 and even 6 lane "residential" arterials in many communities that are under posted, 25 or even 20 m.p.h. seems a perfectly reasonable speed limit on most non arterial residential streets. Most residential streets are not intended to be used as through routes and low speed limits are perfectly reasonable in many areas, including even some arterial residential streets. The primary focus of advocating the raising of speed limits should be on roads and highways where the current speed limit in unreasonably low and clearly motivated by "revenue generation" rather reasonable safety concerns.

[texaskdog]

25 is too low for residential streets, especially straight ones without any twists and turns, should be 30-35.

Based on what?  The fatality rate for pedestrians in car-pedestrian accidents goes up alarmingly when speeds are over about 25 mph.  These are city streets, not freeways.  There are kids, pets, etc., who enter the road unexpectedly.

What I think is funny is when an undivided 2-lane road is 45 but then when it splits and has an island in the middle it drops to 35. 

Can you imagine a 55 MPH maximum speed limit now?

[kkt]

Can you imagine a 55 MPH maximum speed limit now?

Yes, I'm happy that the speed limit on rural freeways is higher than 55.  I'm not sure what that has to do with speed limits on residential streets.

[MarkF]

That must have been referring to I-5 through Camp Pendleton.  I think it was less than a year earlier that it was raised to 70 through there.

The newspaper caption says San Diego freeway in Orange County. Camp Pendleton is in San Diego County. They are probably talking about I-5 from El Toro South to San Clemente

That stretch was 65, it went up to 70 at the SD county line.  Went though that stretch from Las Pulgas to I-405 a lot back then.

[kendancy66]

That must have been referring to I-5 through Camp Pendleton.  I think it was less than a year earlier that it was raised to 70 through there.

The newspaper caption says San Diego freeway in Orange County. Camp Pendleton is in San Diego County. They are probably talking about I-5 from El Toro South to San Clemente

That stretch was 65, it went up to 70 at the SD county line.  Went though that stretch from Las Pulgas to I-405 a lot back then.

So where were the 70 mph speed limits on San Diego Freeway in Orange County that the newspaper caption was referring to?

I definetly believe you are correct about the location of the 70 mph though.  The Camp Pendleton area is the only place were the higher limit would make sense.

[MarkF]

That must have been referring to I-5 through Camp Pendleton.  I think it was less than a year earlier that it was raised to 70 through there.

The newspaper caption says San Diego freeway in Orange County. Camp Pendleton is in San Diego County. They are probably talking about I-5 from El Toro South to San Clemente

That stretch was 65, it went up to 70 at the SD county line.  Went though that stretch from Las Pulgas to I-405 a lot back then.

So where were the 70 mph speed limits on San Diego Freeway in Orange County that the newspaper caption was referring to?

I definetly believe you are correct about the location of the 70 mph though.  The Camp Pendleton area is the only place were the higher limit would make sense.

My guess would be just north of the SD county line on the southbound side, around the Cristianitos exit.  That is where it used to go from 6 lanes to 8.  Or it could have just been sloppy reporting, I've seen references to Camp Pendleton being in Orange County before.

[oscar]

That must have been referring to I-5 through Camp Pendleton.  I think it was less than a year earlier that it was raised to 70 through there.

The newspaper caption says San Diego freeway in Orange County. Camp Pendleton is in San Diego County. They are probably talking about I-5 from El Toro South to San Clemente

That stretch was 65, it went up to 70 at the SD county line.  Went though that stretch from Las Pulgas to I-405 a lot back then.

I lived in Oceanside, just south of the Camp Pendleton Marine Corps base, in that era. I remember repeatedly seeing from the southbound freeway through the base, after the reduction to 55mph, a white-on-black 60mph speed limit sign on a closed-to-motor vehicles segment of old US 101. I wondered if that sign was deliberately left there, just to taunt us motorists stuck with the lower NMSL limit. That sign has long been removed, from what is now part of a bike trail.

I also recall reluctance to increase the limit through the base to 70mph after the repeal of NMSL, due to problems with migrants running (but often not fast enough) across the freeway to avoid the Border Patrol checkpoint on northbound I-5 within the base.

[mrsman]

That must have been referring to I-5 through Camp Pendleton.  I think it was less than a year earlier that it was raised to 70 through there.

The newspaper caption says San Diego freeway in Orange County. Camp Pendleton is in San Diego County. They are probably talking about I-5 from El Toro South to San Clemente

That stretch was 65, it went up to 70 at the SD county line.  Went though that stretch from Las Pulgas to I-405 a lot back then.

I lived in Oceanside, just south of the Camp Pendleton Marine Corps base, in that era. I remember repeatedly seeing from the southbound freeway through the base, after the reduction to 55mph, a white-on-black 60mph speed limit sign on a closed-to-motor vehicles segment of old US 101. I wondered if that sign was deliberately left there, just to taunt us motorists stuck with the lower NMSL limit. That sign has long been removed, from what is now part of a bike trail.

I also recall reluctance to increase the limit through the base to 70mph after the repeal of NMSL, due to problems with migrants running (but often not fast enough) across the freeway to avoid the Border Patrol checkpoint on northbound I-5 within the base.

The stretch of I-5 in SD county is much busier than other rural segments (like I-5 through the SJ Valley or I-10 through the desert).  65 MPH is fine, even if it was 70 in the early '70's.