Some students are returning to school with new bans in effect

[kkt]

From my perspective, the emphasis is to prepare young people for the adult workplace.

No grade school child needs to be prepared for the adult workplace via a dress code. That's nonsense.

You want to establish good habits while they are young. Dress shirts and ties? Nope. T-shifts with questionable messages? Probably.

Ah, but the devil's in the details.  Who decides what's questionable?

[kkt]

1) Safety - banning hoodies can fall into this category along with other outerwear that could be used to conceal dangerous items

But if you need to wear a jacket into school during the winter, is that not just as "concealing" as a hoodie would be?

I wasn't talking about wearing it to school and then putting it in your locker or hung up somewhere. I was thinking more of wearing it all day. Not even letting them wear the hoodie to school is extreme.

Many schools here have open hallways - to go between classrooms or between classroom and the cafeteria, you're outside.  Kids are going to need their hoodies with them.

[Molandfreak]

What if kids have decided early on that they don't want to have a desk job? My primary job is outside, and my supervisors don't care what I wear as long as it isn't potentially offensive to others. Whatever I'm wearing is always covered up by hi-vis PPE anyway.

If you are talking about Personal Protection Equipment, that is your job's "dress code".

I guess you do you, but I wouldn't call a hi-vis vest and hat supplied by my employer a "dress code" any more than a welding mask and gloves. At least not in the same sense that requiring a dress shirt and tie is a dress code. It's more like common sense.

School isn't just about preparing students for the workforce, it's also about teaching critical thinking skills, enlightening minds, and making social connections. In what way do alternative aesthetics hinder those goals?

The words that I used at the start of this thread is "skills to be self-sufficient adults and contributing members of society". As such, reducing the distractions helps in this aspect.... especially when we are talking about an age range where hormones are "raging".

If a student has a crush on someone in class, they're going to be distracted on one level or another regardless of what they're wearing. I don't think anyone is disputing that students should be reasonably covered up in school--we may have different visions of what that looks like, sure, but it sure doesn't look like a ban on black clothing.

[JayhawkCO]

Just to give context on the black clothing thing, and not saying one way or the other how I feel about it, immediately after Columbine, my high school (de facto in Littleton, CO) had a ban on trench coats.

[bugo]

I don't have kids.  Therefore I'm not losing sleep over weird things educators do like banning black clothes. 

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

[formulanone]

I don't have kids.  Therefore I'm not losing sleep over weird things educators do like banning black clothes. 

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Then they came for the insomniacs because I didn't lose any sleep.

[Max Rockatansky]

I don't have kids.  Therefore I'm not losing sleep over weird things educators do like banning black clothes. 

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Then they came for the insomniacs because I didn't lose any sleep.

Then they came for the Tamales because we can't have potlucks anymore.

[Scott5114]

We all need to band together and start suing schools.

Unfortunately, when someone sues the school district, the whole community has to pay for that. Including you.

If you want to force change, the far more effective strategy is to band together and win a school board election.

1) Safety - banning hoodies can fall into this category along with other outerwear that could be used to conceal dangerous items

When I was in high school I wore a hoodie every day, so I could conceal dangerous items in it like protractors, and $2 bills.

Why, to think, someone could have paid me $3 to measure an angle for them, and then I would have been able to break a $5 bill for them. And nobody would have been any the wiser.

The horror.

[mgk920]

And for those that prohibit students from possessing images of guns, does that include quarters showing people with guns (there are several)?

Mike

[SEWIGuy]

And for those that prohibit students from possessing images of guns, does that include quarters showing people with guns (there are several)?

Mike

Do kids carry quarters?

[jeffandnicole]

And for those that prohibit students from possessing images of guns, does that include quarters showing people with guns (there are several)?

Mike

Do kids carry quarters?

To use the pay phone to call mom and dad for a ride home when their after-school activity is done. (circa 1983)

[JayhawkCO]

And for those that prohibit students from possessing images of guns, does that include quarters showing people with guns (there are several)?

Mike

Do kids carry quarters?

To use the pay phone to call mom and dad for a ride home when their after-school activity is done. (circa 1983)

They probably were mixed in with their milk tokens.

[NE2]

And for those that prohibit students from possessing images of guns, does that include quarters showing people with guns (there are several)?

Mike

Do kids carry quarters?

To use the pay phone to call mom and dad for a ride home when their after-school activity is done. (circa 1983)

That's what collect calls are for. State your name. Dan Pickmeup.

[webny99]

Maybe I'm the only one who doesn't mind a school uniform? For elementary school (JK-Grade 8), there was no uniform, but high school (Grade 9-12) had a uniform. The uniform didn't bother me at all, and it was actually kind of convenient.

Agreed on the convenience, and it's also good for reducing social pressure and potential for cliques and bullying to occur at school. I think knowing what you're going to wear to school and not having to worry what others think of it is actually a pretty big relief.. especially in your sensitive tween and early teen years. Sure, some schools are getting rightly criticized for their excessive dress code rules (and some, like "no black clothes" are bizarre), but I don't think that has blanket application to uniforms.

The point of uniforms generally is not to force an unwanted dress code on the students, but rather reinforce that you're there to learn by reducing distractions and creating a more equitable educational experience. I think those who are disagreeing may be weighing their adult perspective and adult desire for individual expression too heavily rather than reflecting on how they would have felt about it when they were a student. As a student, chances are you probably don't really care what you're wearing that much, and at that age not having to actively make fashion choices is a good thing in just about every way imaginable.

[Molandfreak]

And for those that prohibit students from possessing images of guns, does that include quarters showing people with guns (there are several)?

Mike

Did the OP mention a ban on images of guns? I'm sure whatever you're talking about is very context-specific and nobody would get in trouble for having historical weaponry images or quarters (or the flags of Mozambique or Guatemala).

Clothing that prominently features alcohol or tobacco brands is banned in schools, but I think you would be hard-pressed to find someone getting in trouble for carrying around a picture of a prohibition-era alcohol bust, for example.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

Maybe I'm the only one who doesn't mind a school uniform? For elementary school (JK-Grade 8), there was no uniform, but high school (Grade 9-12) had a uniform. The uniform didn't bother me at all, and it was actually kind of convenient.

I think those who are disagreeing may be weighing their adult perspective and adult desire for individual expression too heavily rather than reflecting on how they would have felt about it when they were a student.

Referring to my post on page 1 about power tripping administrators I freely admit some of it is from an adult perspective as I learned how other adults think and act once I became one myself. Many adults just want to be bullies especially if their being an asshole is fully sanctioned. I have real concerns about administrators using dress codes to bully students they just don't like. Sure, they'll find other reasons to harass kids anyway, but dress codes/hair codes have always been a frequent favorite to target students just because they don't like them.

[webny99]

Maybe I'm the only one who doesn't mind a school uniform? For elementary school (JK-Grade 8), there was no uniform, but high school (Grade 9-12) had a uniform. The uniform didn't bother me at all, and it was actually kind of convenient.

I think those who are disagreeing may be weighing their adult perspective and adult desire for individual expression too heavily rather than reflecting on how they would have felt about it when they were a student.

Referring to my post on page 1 about power tripping administrators I freely admit some of it is from an adult perspective as I learned how other adults think and act once I became one myself. Many adults just want to be bullies especially if their being an asshole is fully sanctioned. I have real concerns about administrators using dress codes to bully students they just don't like. Sure, they'll find other reasons to harass kids anyway, but dress codes/hair codes have always been a frequent favorite to target students just because they don't like them.

That's why just having uniforms is in some ways better than having a dress code (especially a strict dress code) because it removes all the drama and ambiguity around what's allowed and what's not. I have fortunately never been in a situation where higher ups at school or elsewhere have specifically used a dress code to target someone, but it sounds terrible and I am sorry anyone has had to experience it.

[Big John]

And for those that prohibit students from possessing images of guns, does that include quarters showing people with guns (there are several)?

Mike

Did the OP mention a ban on images of guns? I'm sure whatever you're talking about is very context-specific and nobody would get in trouble for having historical weaponry images or quarters (or the flags of Mozambique or Guatemala).

Clothing that prominently features alcohol or tobacco brands is banned in schools, but I think you would be hard-pressed to find someone getting in trouble for carrying around a picture of a prohibition-era alcohol bust, for example.

Are the students making their coins visible to other students? If not there is no problem. Such as if a student was wearing a shirt with a prohibited image or message, the principal would usually make the student wear the shirt inside out for the rest of the day.

[1995hoo]

Are the students making their coins visible to other students? If not there is no problem. Such as if a student was wearing a shirt with a prohibited image or message, the principal would usually make the student wear the shirt inside out for the rest of the day.

I remember when I was in high school, while there was no dress code a teacher once tried to make me turn my t-shirt inside out. It was from Pennsylvania Dutch country and it referred to a fictional university in a town with an infamous name: Intercourse University.

I refused to turn the shirt inside out unless she also made one of the girls turn her shirt inside out. Hers had the logo of a surf wax company on it. I'm sure some of you remember those shirts: Mr. Zog's Sex Wax, "The Best for Your Stick." The teacher backed down, probably because she was unwilling to make a girl turn her shirt inside out yet also knew that I would have made a very big deal out of her having a double standard (which I would have, as I was on the school newspaper staff and I could and would have written a column about it).

[thspfc]

Banning mirrors is one of the most pathetic ideas our society has come up with in the last decade. The lack of mirrors itself is not an issue, but the reasoning behind it is.

Even if you take the idea at face value - seeing your own reflection can lead to low self esteem - what is the lesson that is being taught to young people? It goes beyond body image issues . . . take away the mirror so you never have to see your reflection, never have to face your problems, never have to learn to appreciate yourself or work at anything to become someone you're proud of. Just pretend your problems don't exist.

[vdeane]

When it comes to dress codes, you know the rules, and so do I.  Also, on Wednesdays, we wear pink.

[kkt]

If there was a dress code in high school, I didn't look at it and just wore what I felt like.  I never heard of anyone getting in trouble for clothing.

[JayhawkCO]

Banning mirrors is one of the most pathetic ideas our society has come up with in the last decade. The lack of mirrors itself is not an issue, but the reasoning behind it is.

Even if you take the idea at face value - seeing your own reflection can lead to low self esteem - what is the lesson that is being taught to young people? It goes beyond body image issues . . . take away the mirror so you never have to see your reflection, never have to face your problems, never have to learn to appreciate yourself or work at anything to become someone you're proud of. Just pretend your problems don't exist.

Not saying anyone is lying, but is there a district is actually banning mirrors? Or is this an "eating cats and dogs" kind of thing where one idiot starts a rumor on Facebook and all of a sudden we have mass hysteria?

[Max Rockatansky]

I looked it up after I saw the mirror thing and there are a couple actual news stories:

https://www.edweek.org/leadership/a-school-removed-bathroom-mirrors-to-keep-students-from-making-tiktoks-will-it-work/2024/02

https://www.cnn.com/2024/09/03/us/back-to-school-bans-cell-phones-hoodies-mirrors/index.html

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/education/2024/01/29/north-carolina-middle-school-removes-bathroom-mirrors-tiktok/72398484007/

https://nypost.com/2024/01/21/news/north-carolina-southern-alamance-middle-school-takes-mirrors-away-from-students-over-tiktok/

Maybe school boards are now stocked with vampires?  We'll know if suddenly garlic and sunlight gets banned.

[kkt]

Are students allowed to carry compact mirrors?