Minor things that bother you

[roadman65]

Remember the whole lockdown thing was stupid.  We never done that during flu epidemics.

Well...maybe we should have?

Of course politics didn't enter the norm before.  Just like for years things were named after Confederate Generals and now all of a sudden we have to rename as it's all of a sudden offensive to people.

Or what about the Cleveland Indians all of a sudden became offensive to Native Americans.  The FSU Seminoles almost had to change but the Seminole Tribe spoke up and said leave us alone.

Neither one of these things were "all of the sudden" offensive to people. You just weren't listening.

Then explain why all these years you had the Washington Redskins, Cleveland Indians, Fort Hood, Fort Gordon, and Fort ( Braxton ) Bragg with no one thinking much of the names.  All of a sudden some Rogue Police Officers murder a suspect and it's now a big deal with the military bases named after Confederate people.

I'm not sure the events that lead to renaming sports teams, but we lived with it for decades and now we decide to move. 

[hotdogPi]

As for cemeteries: what about putting them in floodplains?

[kphoger]

Neither one of these things were "all of the sudden" offensive to people. You just weren't listening.

Then explain why all these years you had the Washington Redskins, Cleveland Indians, Fort Hood, Fort Gordon, and Fort ( Braxton ) Bragg with no one thinking much of the names.  All of a sudden some Rogue Police Officers murder a suspect and it's now a big deal with the military bases named after Confederate people.

I'm not sure the events that lead to renaming sports teams, but we lived with it for decades and now we decide to move. 

1.  Dude.  Even if you're right.  Are you trying to start an argument here?

2.  The answer to your question is still exactly what SEWIGuy said.  People were offended.  You just didn't hear about it as much.

[Max Rockatansky]

I will say that there was some benefits for me personally during the COVID years:

-  Most of the people I had a difficult time working with because of personality conflicts ended up retiring. 

-  I had much of the Sierra Nevada almost entirely to myself until about Spring 2022.

-  My bench press went way up given I was doing a ton of garage weight lifting and push-ups.

-  I did pretty well on investments given I never pulled money out of the stock market.

[roadman65]

Neither one of these things were "all of the sudden" offensive to people. You just weren't listening.

Then explain why all these years you had the Washington Redskins, Cleveland Indians, Fort Hood, Fort Gordon, and Fort ( Braxton ) Bragg with no one thinking much of the names.  All of a sudden some Rogue Police Officers murder a suspect and it's now a big deal with the military bases named after Confederate people.

I'm not sure the events that lead to renaming sports teams, but we lived with it for decades and now we decide to move. 

1.  Dude.  Even if you're right.  Are you trying to start an argument here?

2.  The answer to your question is still exactly what SEWIGuy said.  People were offended.  You just didn't hear about it as much.

Not trying to start an argument.  Just stating fact.  People are offensive like you just said, but SEWIguy was the one that said people aren't offensive and I was ignorant for not knowing that.

He did not say people were offended as I was the one that said people were offended.

Let's just drop this. It all started when I stated during COVID one restaurant didn't use regular menus for sanitary reasons and it erupted into a political topic.

[SEWIGuy]

Then explain why all these years you had the Washington Redskins, Cleveland Indians, Fort Hood, Fort Gordon, and Fort ( Braxton ) Bragg with no one thinking much of the names.  All of a sudden some Rogue Police Officers murder a suspect and it's now a big deal with the military bases named after Confederate people.

I'm not sure the events that lead to renaming sports teams, but we lived with it for decades and now we decide to move.

Again, if you think that "no one was thinking much of the names" prior to then, I have no idea what to tell you. But you are wrong.

I wrote a high school paper in the mid-80s about an article that came out in Sports Illustrated (I think) about the inappropriateness of the Redskins name. Marquette (my alma mater) changed its nickname from "Warriors" to "Golden Eagles" in the mid-90s. St. John's changed from "Redmen" to "Red Storm" at about the same time. The high school my kids went to dropped all their native imagery in the early 2000s.

Etc. etc. etc.,

As for the confederate generals? They were losers. Rebellious losers. Screw 'em.

[kernals12]

KPMG sounds like a radio station, not an auditing firm.

[kphoger]

I only encountered it one time where it was the only option.

What are customers supposed to do if they didn't bring a phone to the restaurant?

The same thing they're supposed to do if they didn't bring a wallet to the restaurant

My cell phone isn't even a smartphone.  What am I supposed to do if I go to that restaurant and bring both my phone and my wallet?

Because fuck anyone without a phone, I guess.

Do I need to say how much fun it is to have your whole family try and pore over a single cell phone to figure out what they all want to order?  Like, if you take your four kids out to eat but none of them even has a cell phone.

Because fuck the wishes of old people, I guess.

Or Greek Orthodox Christians, or Muslims, or Orthodox Jews.

[roadman65]

Then explain why all these years you had the Washington Redskins, Cleveland Indians, Fort Hood, Fort Gordon, and Fort ( Braxton ) Bragg with no one thinking much of the names.  All of a sudden some Rogue Police Officers murder a suspect and it's now a big deal with the military bases named after Confederate people.

I'm not sure the events that lead to renaming sports teams, but we lived with it for decades and now we decide to move.

Again, if you think that "no one was thinking much of the names" prior to then, I have no idea what to tell you. But you are wrong.

I wrote a high school paper in the mid-80s about an article that came out in Sports Illustrated (I think) about the inappropriateness of the Redskins name. Marquette (my alma mater) changed its nickname from "Warriors" to "Golden Eagles" in the mid-90s. St. John's changed from "Redmen" to "Red Storm" at about the same time. The high school my kids went to dropped all their native imagery in the early 2000s.

Etc. etc. etc.,

As for the confederate generals? They were losers. Rebellious losers. Screw 'em.

I didn't say they weren't thinking it, but facts speak for themselves.  The changes came later on in life and not before.

I'm talking about it took years to act.

[kphoger]

Neither one of these things were "all of the sudden" offensive to people. You just weren't listening.

The answer to your question is still exactly what SEWIGuy said.  People were offended.  You just didn't hear about it as much.

He did not say people were offended

He literally said that.

[roadman65]

Neither one of these things were "all of the sudden" offensive to people. You just weren't listening.

The answer to your question is still exactly what SEWIGuy said.  People were offended.  You just didn't hear about it as much.

He did not say people were offended

He literally said that.

He said,.
Neither one of these things were "all of the sudden" offensive to people. You just weren't listening.

That could be interpreted as being no one was ever offended.

[SEWIGuy]

I didn't say they weren't thinking it, but facts speak for themselves.  The changes came later on in life and not before.

I'm talking about it took years to act.

No you weren't. You were claiming that the Confederate general names and native nicknames suddenly became offensive. Here is the quote with emphasis added:

Of course politics didn't enter the norm before.  Just like for years things were named after Confederate Generals and now all of a sudden we have to rename as it's all of a sudden offensive to people.

Or what about the Cleveland Indians all of a sudden became offensive to Native Americans.  The FSU Seminoles almost had to change but the Seminole Tribe spoke up and said leave us alone.

[roadman65]

They did become all of sudden because of they weren't the names would have changed a long time ago.

That doesn't mean that they were and weren't thinking about it


I'm through dealing with your immaturity.

I've said to much already to give into your sensitivity.

[Max Rockatansky]

I'm surprised that Fort Bragg, California has maintained the name it currently has.  The city was named after Braxton Bragg and gets challenged a lot by interest groups who find it offensive. 

https://www.deseret.com/u-s-world/2022/1/31/22910928/fort-braggs-california-named-for-confederate-general-commision-declines-name-change/

Recently an unincorporated community in Fresno County was rebranded as Yokuts Valley from Squaw Valley.  That change wasn't popular locally but given it isn't an incorporated area I guess they didn't have much grounds to resist.  A lot of the businesses still display the older name. 

[SEWIGuy]

They did become all of sudden because of they weren't the names would have changed a long time ago.

That doesn't mean that they were and weren't thinking about it

No, that's not accurate. A significant segment of the population felt that Redskins, Indians, etc. have been offensive for a long time. And people weren't just "thinking about it." They were writing about it, and teams and schools were responding to it, for decades. I provided all sorts of examples.

I'm through dealing with your immaturity.

I've said to much already to give into your sensitivity.

*MY* immaturity? I have repeatedly shown you are wrong, yet you can't admit it. All that immaturity lies with you.

And I have no idea what the second sentence means.

[roadman65]

I'm surprised that Fort Bragg, California has maintained the name it currently has.  The city was named after Braxton Bragg and gets challenged a lot by interest groups who find it offensive. 

https://www.deseret.com/u-s-world/2022/1/31/22910928/fort-braggs-california-named-for-confederate-general-commision-declines-name-change/

Recently an unincorporated community in Fresno County was rebranded as Yokuts Valley from Squaw Valley.  That change wasn't popular locally but given it isn't an incorporated area I guess they didn't have much grounds to resist.  A lot of the businesses still display the older name.

With Fort Bragg in California it seems, according to the article, that it could be temporary as the powers that be are keeping the name because they're divided as much as it's citizens.

Still if there was enough urgency it would be ( or would have been) renamed along time ago. 

The fact it's taking years probably because most don't condone the actions of Confederacy, but the issue that it's reminding us of history of how freedom didn't come cheap and America fought to become what it is.

I personally didn't like the fact that places in Virginia were named after Confederate people, but at the same time it reminded me the fact we had to fight a Civil War.  Plus I am not from that state and grew up in New Jersey at the time thinking this so I came up with that rationale too despite not being in power to change.

[kphoger]

That doesn't mean that they were and weren't thinking about it

It only means that in Alanland.

[kphoger]

... most don't condone the actions of Confederacy, but the issue that it's reminding us of history of how freedom didn't come cheap and America fought to become what it is.

I personally didn't like the fact that places in Virginia were named after Confederate people, but at the same time it reminded me the fact we had to fight a Civil War.  Plus I am not from that state and grew up in New Jersey at the time thinking this so I came up with that rationale too despite not being in power to change.

I used to agree.  But the problem is that naming a military base or monument after someone, or erecting a statue of someone, or whatever, is inherently honoring that person.  Saying that the name or the statue or whatever serves as a reminder of how bad the person was seems to run contrary to common sense.

[roadman65]

They did become all of sudden because of they weren't the names would have changed a long time ago.

That doesn't mean that they were and weren't thinking about it

No, that's not accurate. A significant segment of the population felt that Redskins, Indians, etc. have been offensive for a long time. And people weren't just "thinking about it." They were writing about it, and teams and schools were responding to it, for decades. I provided all sorts of examples.

I'm through dealing with your immaturity.

I've said to much already to give into your sensitivity.

*MY* immaturity? I have repeatedly shown you are wrong, yet you can't admit it. All that immaturity lies with you.

And I have no idea what the second sentence means.

It means I'm just as bad as you in keeping this silly argument alive. I'm not going to say more as it's useless.

Point is Cleveland Indians were a name for years. It took till now to realize it.  It could have been renamed years ago but wasn't. That's my point.  Regardless of groups over the times not appreciating it is not relevant (except to you).

That's what I was referring to, not that small groups behind the scenes were arguing over decades.  The fact is it took till now to act.  Maybe I should have said that in the beginning, but running into yo I wasn't counting on.

[1995hoo]

My mom was a big proponent of the cost effectiveness of cremation.  I won't lie, it did save me a bunch of money and hassle not having to worry about a funeral plot.  My wife (then fiancé) and held a kick ass ash spreading ceremony on CA 1 around San Simeon.

My father was eligible for inurnment, but not for in-ground burial, at Arlington National Cemetery. So we had him cremated (and someday my mother will be as well, obviously, so that her cremains can be placed in the same columbarium niche). Of course, that probably annoys kernals12 because the cremains are still in a cemetery.

[SEWIGuy]

They did become all of sudden because of they weren't the names would have changed a long time ago.

That doesn't mean that they were and weren't thinking about it

No, that's not accurate. A significant segment of the population felt that Redskins, Indians, etc. have been offensive for a long time. And people weren't just "thinking about it." They were writing about it, and teams and schools were responding to it, for decades. I provided all sorts of examples.

I'm through dealing with your immaturity.

I've said to much already to give into your sensitivity.

*MY* immaturity? I have repeatedly shown you are wrong, yet you can't admit it. All that immaturity lies with you.

And I have no idea what the second sentence means.

It means I'm just as bad as you in keeping this silly argument alive. I'm not going to say more as it's useless.

Point is Cleveland Indians were a name for years. It took till now to realize it.  It could have been renamed years ago but wasn't. That's my point.  Regardless of groups over the times not appreciating it is not relevant (except to you).

That's what I was referring to, not that small groups behind the scenes were arguing over decades.  The fact is it took till now to act.  Maybe I should have said that in the beginning, but running into yo I wasn't counting on.

I just quoted the words you used. Now you won't stand behind what you actually said. Very immature of you.

[kphoger]

I'm just as bad as you in keeping this silly argument alive. I'm not going to say more as it's useless.

Words to live by.  I'll stop saying anything about the matter as well.

Everyone good with stopping?

[D-Dey65]

Then explain why all these years you had the Washington Redskins, Cleveland Indians, Fort Hood, Fort Gordon, and Fort ( Braxton ) Bragg with no one thinking much of the names.  All of a sudden some Rogue Police Officers murder a suspect and it's now a big deal with the military bases named after Confederate people.

I'm not sure the events that lead to renaming sports teams, but we lived with it for decades and now we decide to move.

Again, if you think that "no one was thinking much of the names" prior to then, I have no idea what to tell you. But you are wrong.

I wrote a high school paper in the mid-80s about an article that came out in Sports Illustrated (I think) about the inappropriateness of the Redskins name. Marquette (my alma mater) changed its nickname from "Warriors" to "Golden Eagles" in the mid-90s. St. John's changed from "Redmen" to "Red Storm" at about the same time. The high school my kids went to dropped all their native imagery in the early 2000s.

Etc. etc. etc.,

As for the confederate generals? They were losers. Rebellious losers. Screw 'em.

To be fair, I know this renaming campaign wasn't "all of the sudden," but the call to change the names got a lot louder after George Floyd was killed. On the issue of sports teams with Native American-associated names, you've got one side calling to rename every team they can find because they think those names besmirch indigenous Americans. At the same time, you have other groups of the First Peoples who couldn't care either way and just want their standards of living improved.

Regarding the Confederate associated monuments and other stuff, I say if we're going to have people who want to expose unflattering aspects of US history such as slavery, we should also be willing to expose unflattering aspects such as the Confederate States of America and the post-Civil War efforts to ruin the advances of Reconstruction. The C.S.A. did occupy various states in the southern US, so if you see a flag of Spain, the UK, France or other nations in the Old Tallahassee Capitol Building, it shouldn't be a bad thing to see the "Stars and Bars" among them and shouldn't be viewed as an endorsement of white supremacy, or segregation. The confederates had battles on old trails that became roads, as well as courthouses, train stations, and other sites, and even cemeteries where they buried their dead. So when I see confederate monuments at these locations, it's just part of history as far as I'm concerned. It doesn't make me think white people are better than everyone else, and anyone who isn't white had better do as they're told. And if you actually think white people are better than everyone else, and non-whites should "stay in their places," then you're an idiot.

I hate the Ku Klux Klan as much as anyone else, but I wouldn't want to see the historic marker showing the site where they were established torn down because some left-wing zealot is offended by it. Just the same, I hate it when right-wing fanatics keep trying to tear down the historic markers associated with groups like the Deacons for Defense and Justice.

[hotdogPi]

As for cemeteries: what about putting them in floodplains?

This got lost in the debate. If cemeteries take up valuable real estate, could this work?

[SEWIGuy]

I don't think cemeteries take up that much space. And no, you shouldn't put them in floodplains unless you want to rebury people constantly.