New US 15 at the NY/PA border

[Michael]

^^ Agreed.  I LOVE that photo set!  Jeff, do you have higher resolution versions of the photos?

On a side note, I wouldn't mind seeing these along the freeway:

[treichard]

Wouldn't be the first US route to end at a state border.... (US-25)

It wasn't far from being the first.

When US 15 ended at the PA/NY border in the 1920s, it was NY 2 IIRC in NY.  PA was annoyed that the new US Hwys. didn't follow their state highways well (e.g., cross-state PA 4 had at least 4 US Hwy numbers instead of one) and requested a revision that added more US Hwy. mileage in the state. US 15 got extended from somewhere south  (was it Frederick, MD? Camp Hill, PA? I can't remember which parts were US 240 and when) to the NY border. But NY didn't adopt the change right away, so for some time, US 15 ended at the PA/NY border. There's a map on the web somewhere that shows this.
Something similar may have happened with US 220 and US 309.

Last fall, AASHTO disapproved of a border-breaking US 15.  

Added: Here's the map I mentioned.
Added: ftp://ftp.dot.state.pa.us/public/pdf/BPR_pdf_files/Maps/Statewide/Historic_OTMs/1930fr.pdf
Oops, US 15 hadn't taken over US 111 yet, but it ends at the state line.

[PAHighways]

^^ Agreed.  I LOVE that photo set!  Jeff, do you have higher resolution versions of the photos?

That site isn't mine, but rather one maintained by a gentleman by the name of John Walter.  Personally I do not have any pictures of the PA 287 to New York section, just ones that Doug has sent me.

[Alex]

^^^

Thanks for the photos and preserving this memories of this stretch for those who of us who couldn't. 

I have photos from May 2005 taken along U.S. 15 northbound between Williamsport and New York that I've not posted anywhere. I also have a couple of videos from 1993/94 of U.S. 15 that I could convert to digital at some point.

[Michael]

^^^ Please do it!  I especially miss the Steam Valley section.

Also, does anyone have pre-construction high resolution photos of US 15 South?

[treichard]

I'm curious if  PA 287 is well signed between PA 49 and the NY state border, now that it was extended over the former US 15 route.  PennDOT maps show that section being an extension of SR 1015 rather than SR 0287, but there is one sign in Google Maps Street View that suggests it is PA 287. So there might be a discrepancy.

[Roadgeek Adam]

I'm curious if  PA 287 is well signed between PA 49 and the NY state border, now that it was extended over the former US 15 route.  PennDOT maps show that section being an extension of SR 1015 rather than SR 0287, but there is one sign in Google Maps Street View that suggests it is PA 287. So there might be a discrepancy.

When I worked on the Wikipedia article, I ended the description at 49 with a passing mention of 1015, my gut feeling is if NYSDOT designates NY 287 on the other side, they'll can SR 1015 and just make SR 287 official

[mightyace]

I'm curious if  PA 287 is well signed between PA 49 and the NY state border, now that it was extended over the former US 15 route.  PennDOT maps show that section being an extension of SR 1015 rather than SR 0287, but there is one sign in Google Maps Street View that suggests it is PA 287. So there might be a discrepancy.

The Pennsylvania SR1015 & SR 0287 are PennDOT internal numbers.  Just as SR 1015 was signed as US 15, they could (not saying they will) sign it as PA 287 but still be SR 1015 internally.

[PAHighways]

I'm curious if  PA 287 is well signed between PA 49 and the NY state border, now that it was extended over the former US 15 route.  PennDOT maps show that section being an extension of SR 1015 rather than SR 0287, but there is one sign in Google Maps Street View that suggests it is PA 287. So there might be a discrepancy.

The Pennsylvania SR1015 & SR 0287 are PennDOT internal numbers.  Just as SR 1015 was signed as US 15, they could (not saying they will) sign it as PA 287 but still be SR 1015 internally.

Everything I have seen from PennDOT show it as just SR 1015.  The shield might have been erroneously installed or it was installed for an eventual extension.  If that's the case, it will probably get changed to SR 0287 just as when the expressway was under construction, it was designated SR 6015 but now it's SR 0015.

[Michael]

I came across an interesting find today.  I was looking at the 1998 Edition of the "New York State Atlas" from NYSDOT at my college library, and the map of Chemung and Steuben Counties showed NY 15 starting at I-390 just south of Wayland at Exit 3.  According to various roadgeek Web pages, it was signed from US 15 along NY 17 and I-390 at that time.  The map didn't show that.

EDIT: I just took a look at the NYSDOT 1:24000 Digital Raster Quads from 1977, and they don't show a NY 17/NY 15 and I-390/NY 15 duplex, either.

[vdeane]

It might have been officially truncated at that time.  NYSDOT never bothered to actually remove signage from that area, so NY 15 signage only gets removed when the signs wear out.  The signage is still there, in most places, but over time it will slowly fade away (the new signs on I-390 south at I-86 only list I-86, for example; NY 17 and NY 15 are not on them).

Btw, any idea where one can get a NYSDOT road atlas?  I don't think I've ever seen official state maps other than the Thruway ones and the tourism maps, both of which are fold-out maps.

[agentsteel53]

On a side note, I wouldn't mind seeing these along the freeway:

I would be shocked and appalled.  Bad route number, bad specifications, bad everything all around.  

(and, honestly, where does everyone seem to get the '70-spec vector drawings??  I know for a fact I have never disseminated one, and most everyone on the Road-Related Illustrations thread seems to share only their more unique and arcane vectors.  Yet dog-common '70 spec crap floats around the internet like sewage - where is it seeping from???)

There's one good-looking US-15 shield left in downtown Corning, and the only good I-99 shield is a dead I-99 shield.



don't mind the ugly 390 and 21 shields.

[Michael]

Btw, any idea where one can get a NYSDOT road atlas?  I don't think I've ever seen official state maps other than the Thruway ones and the tourism maps, both of which are fold-out maps.

There was a map in the front of the atlas showing the state office campus with a map room.  I don't remember if there was a phone number or not.

(and, honestly, where does everyone seem to get the '70-spec vector drawings??  I know for a fact I have never disseminated one, and most everyone on the Road-Related Illustrations thread seems to share only their more unique and arcane vectors.  Yet dog-common '70 spec crap floats around the internet like sewage - where is it seeping from???)

I just got the shields from Wikipedia and put them next to each other.  It literally took 5 minutes.  In my opinion, the 15 in the photo you posted is too narrow (Series C?) for the shield.  I-99 doesn't bother me like it does some people.  I just don't want US 15 to be truncated to Williamsport.

[froggie]

(and, honestly, where does everyone seem to get the '70-spec vector drawings??  I know for a fact I have never disseminated one, and most everyone on the Road-Related Illustrations thread seems to share only their more unique and arcane vectors.  Yet dog-common '70 spec crap floats around the internet like sewage - where is it seeping from???)

One person's sewage is another person's fertilizer.  I've never understood your (and a few others) antipathy towards the '70 spec shields...and probably never will.

[agentsteel53]

if we're gonna be averse to cutouts, I'd be perfectly happy with shields like this:



that's actually California's earlier 1957 spec, slightly different angles.  here's California's early-1957 spec for three-digit route markers.



both of those shapes are significantly better-looking than '70 spec.  if you're going to use '70 spec, because of functional vs. aesthetic concerns, you may as well just use a plain square.

[Michael in Philly]

Btw, any idea where one can get a NYSDOT road atlas?  I don't think I've ever seen official state maps other than the Thruway ones and the tourism maps, both of which are fold-out maps.

There used to be pretty decent county (or pairs-of-counties, like Westchester-Rockland) topographic maps - folded, scale probably 1:50,000 or maybe a bit smaller.  I don't know how I found about about them, but I once went to some state agency (forget which) in suburban Albany to pick some up.  This would have been in the early 90s, though.  I wonder if the atlas would be a compilation of those?

I'd be interested in the atlas too, if the price is right.
Also, how does one get a state tourism map?  I've put in two requests - one many months ago, one A month ago - through iloveny.com.  Nothing yet.

[cu2010]

Also, how does one get a state tourism map?  I've put in two requests - one many months ago, one A month ago - through iloveny.com.  Nothing yet.

I don't think they published one last year...I couldn't find any at all, and they weren't in last year's travel guide like they usually are...prolly a victim of the state having no money...

[WNYroadgeek]

There's one good-looking US-15 shield left in downtown Corning, and the only good I-99 shield is a dead I-99 shield.



don't mind the ugly 390 and 21 shields.

That's in Wayland, not Corning.

[PAHighways]

I just don't want US 15 to be truncated to Williamsport.

That looks to happen since there is no reason to keep the multiplex.  It only makes sense to truncate it at 180/220 and renumber Business US 15 to a 99 business loop.

[Michael in Philly]

Also, how does one get a state tourism map?  I've put in two requests - one many months ago, one A month ago - through iloveny.com.  Nothing yet.

I don't think they published one last year...I couldn't find any at all, and they weren't in last year's travel guide like they usually are...prolly a victim of the state having no money...

Thanks.  What I should have said is I'd put in two requests for general tourist information - most states either send a travel guide and a map, or have a place where you can check off your specific interests or request specific things, and a map will be among those things.  But I've received nothing at all from New York.  (I'm veering off topic here, but Maryland maintains a big information center at the Maryland House service area on I-95 and they've got things from most of the eastern seaboard.  That's where I found a New York guide.  And a North Carolina official map.)

[Henry]

I just don't want US 15 to be truncated to Williamsport.

That looks to happen since there is no reason to keep the multiplex.  It only makes sense to truncate it at 180/220 and renumber Business US 15 to a 99 business loop.

Well, there's always the option of making it Historical US 15, if they do truncate it.

[vdeane]

Thanks.  What I should have said is I'd put in two requests for general tourist information - most states either send a travel guide and a map, or have a place where you can check off your specific interests or request specific things, and a map will be among those things.  But I've received nothing at all from New York.  (I'm veering off topic here, but Maryland maintains a big information center at the Maryland House service area on I-95 and they've got things from most of the eastern seaboard.  That's where I found a New York guide.  And a North Carolina official map.)

The only NY welcome center I can think of off the top of my head is on I-81 five miles south of the Canadian border.  It's possibly maintained by the Thousand Islands Bridge Authority, but its purpose is defiantly to promote tourism in the 1000 Islands and not the state as a whole.

The best place to get a tourism map in NY is in a rest are on the Thruway.

[PAHighways]

I just don't want US 15 to be truncated to Williamsport.

That looks to happen since there is no reason to keep the multiplex.  It only makes sense to truncate it at 180/220 and renumber Business US 15 to a 99 business loop.

Well, there's always the option of making it Historical US 15, if they do truncate it.

There is no reason to make it a historical route any more than to make the Susquehanna Trail "Historic US 111."

[Mr_Northside]

I just don't want US 15 to be truncated to Williamsport.

That looks to happen since there is no reason to keep the multiplex.  It only makes sense to truncate it at 180/220 and renumber Business US 15 to a 99 business loop.

I also agree with the truncating of US-15... Though I think we're more likely to see an extension of PA-660 (Or even an unsigned route)than a Bus. 99.

Once NY finishes their missing link, the bigger bet will be how long there will be 2 separate segments of I-99, since PennDOT seems to have any US-220 (and I-80 interchanges) upgrades on an indefinite hold (at least last I've heard/read)

[rickmastfan67]

I just don't want US 15 to be truncated to Williamsport.

That looks to happen since there is no reason to keep the multiplex.  It only makes sense to truncate it at 180/220 and renumber Business US 15 to a 99 business loop.

I also agree with the truncating of US-15... Though I think we're more likely to see an extension of PA-660 (Or even an unsigned route)than a Bus. 99.

But remember, we did get a I-376 Business out of the PA-60 Business.  I can easily see a Business I-99 replacing US-15 Business.