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Author Topic: US 31 --> I-67 ?  (Read 22281 times)

wdcrft63

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US 31 --> I-67 ?
« on: March 15, 2016, 07:08:02 PM »

Wikipedia claims that there is a proposal to designate the upgraded US 31 north of Indianapolis as I-67. Is this an active idea? What it its status?
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I-39

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2016, 08:01:05 PM »

From what I've gathered, there is some discussion IF US 31 becomes a full freeway from South Bend to Indianapolis, that Indiana will seek to designate it as I-67. As part of the proposal, IIRC, it is to run it up the existing US 31 freeway to Michigan and up to Grand Rapids via the current I-196.

However, that is a long way away. I don't believe there are active projects for freeway conversion on the remaining expressway segments of US 31 between South Bend and Indianapolis (I could be wrong here). Plus, additional upgrades would be needed in the South Bend area, as I don't believe the current freeway there is fully Interstate-standard (again, I could be wrong here).

So the answer is yes, but who knows when. Also, IIRC, there are a few other routes that are competing for the I-67 designation.
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TheHighwayMan394

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2016, 08:21:01 PM »

What would be the purpose of it? Traffic from the west will take I-65 to Indy and traffic from the east will take I-69. It'd be a completely regional route, which in my view doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation.
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wdcrft63

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2016, 09:46:34 PM »

Also, IIRC, there are a few other routes that are competing for the I-67 designation.
I know Kentucky was interested in the I-67 designation at one time, but I believe the latest is that I are thinking about designating the Bowling Green - Owensboro route as I-x65.
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jnewkirk77

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2016, 03:42:31 AM »

Also, IIRC, there are a few other routes that are competing for the I-67 designation.
I know Kentucky was interested in the I-67 designation at one time, but I believe the latest is that I are thinking about designating the Bowling Green - Owensboro route as I-x65.

KYTC has a number that they have proposed for this - I-565. Not sure why 165 or 365 wouldn't have worked, but what do I know?  :spin:
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english si

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2016, 07:35:39 AM »

It'd be a completely regional route, which in my view doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation.
Just because it doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation, doesn't mean it can't have one if the state wants...
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Rothman

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2016, 08:04:22 AM »

As part of the proposal, IIRC, it is to run it up the existing US 31 freeway to Michigan and up to Grand Rapids via the current I-196.

I drove past the northern end of the US 31 freeway in MI along Napier Avenue just a couple of months ago.  Thought I read somewhere that it was never completed to tie into I-94 or I-196 because of local opposition or lack of demand.  Can't imagine that it'd be a priority to build now if it hasn't been already.
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rawmustard

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2016, 09:17:33 AM »

I drove past the northern end of the US 31 freeway in MI along Napier Avenue just a couple of months ago.  Thought I read somewhere that it was never completed to tie into I-94 or I-196 because of local opposition or lack of demand.  Can't imagine that it'd be a priority to build now if it hasn't been already.

It was never completed because it would have encroached on the habitat of an endangered butterfly. The alternative now is to build the freeway up to where BL 94 joins I-94, but construction hasn't yet started.
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Rothman

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2016, 11:53:14 AM »

I drove past the northern end of the US 31 freeway in MI along Napier Avenue just a couple of months ago.  Thought I read somewhere that it was never completed to tie into I-94 or I-196 because of local opposition or lack of demand.  Can't imagine that it'd be a priority to build now if it hasn't been already.

It was never completed because it would have encroached on the habitat of an endangered butterfly. The alternative now is to build the freeway up to where BL 94 joins I-94, but construction hasn't yet started.

Makes me wonder how far work is along getting such a project to construction at this point.
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Rushmeister

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2016, 12:08:55 PM »

I drove past the northern end of the US 31 freeway in MI along Napier Avenue just a couple of months ago.  Thought I read somewhere that it was never completed to tie into I-94 or I-196 because of local opposition or lack of demand.  Can't imagine that it'd be a priority to build now if it hasn't been already.

It was never completed because it would have encroached on the habitat of an endangered butterfly. The alternative now is to build the freeway up to where BL 94 joins I-94, but construction hasn't yet started.

Maybe after the butterfly is extinct we can have out freeway.  Just sayin'...
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theline

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2016, 03:27:05 PM »

I don't believe there are active projects for freeway conversion on the remaining expressway segments of US 31 between South Bend and Indianapolis (I could be wrong here). Plus, additional upgrades would be needed in the South Bend area, as I don't believe the current freeway there is fully Interstate-standard (again, I could be wrong here).

So the answer is yes, but who knows when. Also, IIRC, there are a few other routes that are competing for the I-67 designation.

In addition to the completed freeway conversion in the Kokomo area, the portion from Plymouth to South Bend is done, but for a few details. The portion from I-465 north to just beyond SR-38 is still under construction. An interchange at SR-28 is just starting construction. That's all for now.

The portion of 31 that bypasses South Bend may be up to interstate standards. The part on the southwest side of town was built in the late '50s and was not originally built to interstate standards. It was purportedly upgraded to those standards in the years since the completion of the St. Joseph Valley Parkway (US-20) around South Bend and Elkhart. Considerable reconstruction was done, including replacing 2 overpasses and lowering the highway under another. One thing that would presumably require upgrading is the US-31/US-20 interchange on the south side. US-31 NB is not free flowing, since it follows a loop ramp. The original plans for the Plymouth-South Bend freeway called for replacement of the loop with a flyover, but that was dropped along the way.
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TheHighwayMan394

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2016, 04:58:28 PM »

It'd be a completely regional route, which in my view doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation.
Just because it doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation, doesn't mean it can't have one if the state wants...

You're calling me out for something I didn't say, and that annoys me. I simply said it's not necessary to make that road an Interstate. I never said they couldn't if they're dying to, which they probably will under the "make every freeway an Interstate" craze.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2016, 05:01:31 PM by TheHighwayMan394 »
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cabiness42

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2016, 08:28:55 AM »

US 31 from Plymouth to Peru flows very well.  To me, it would be a lot of unnecessary expense to convert that section just to be able to get an interstate designation.  There are many other projects that are much more important and need to be priorities over that.  If you want to convert the rest of what isn't done from Peru to Noblesville, I'd be fine with that and then that part could be called I-365. 
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english si

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2016, 09:11:26 AM »

You're calling me out for something I didn't say, and that annoys me.
You are calling me out for something I didn't say, and that annoys me.

I simply said that "doesn't necessitate" isn't "can't", something that you agree with.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #14 on: March 17, 2016, 06:36:56 PM »

Although an Interstate 67 designation would fit in the Interstate grid, the road probably should remain just US 31. That is, unless the DOT orchestrates a plan to convert the whole corridor to freeway standards.
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mukade

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2016, 07:06:35 PM »

US 31 from Plymouth to Peru flows very well.  To me, it would be a lot of unnecessary expense to convert that section just to be able to get an interstate designation.  There are many other projects that are much more important and need to be priorities over that.  If you want to convert the rest of what isn't done from Peru to Noblesville, I'd be fine with that and then that part could be called I-365. 

The flip side is that this section would also be the cheapest to upgrade. There are very few, if any, driveways on the road between US 24 and US 30. They would need five or six interchanges, quite a few overpasses (but this area is very lightly populated), and a bridge over that one railroad near Plymouth. So to me, the question is more about the value received from doing it.

South of US 24 to Kokomo will be much more problematic just like Tipton County.
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mukade

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2016, 09:47:32 PM »

What would be the purpose of it? Traffic from the west will take I-65 to Indy and traffic from the east will take I-69. It'd be a completely regional route, which in my view doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation.

I-65 and I-69 follow completely different directions than US 31. A new I-67 would connect Indianapolis (1.75M metro) to Grand Rapids (1.03M metro) and passing thru South Bend/Elkhart area which is over 500K. Also many 2d Interstate highways are regional routes. I-67, if it were created would be about 250 miles long. Below are the lengths of other 2dis for comparison:

   I-17   146
   I-19   102
   i-22   213
   I-27   124
   I-37   143
   I-41   176
   I-43   192
   i-45   285
   i-66   76
   I-68   113
   I-72   184
   I-73   82
   I-78   144
   I-82   144
   I-83   85
   I-84 e   232
   I-86 w   101
   I-88 e   118
   I-88 w   141
   I-89   191
   i-96   192
   I-97   18
   I-99   99

While an Intersate designation would not be necessary, it would be easily justifiable.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2016, 10:09:00 PM by mukade »
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Revive 755

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #17 on: March 17, 2016, 09:51:21 PM »

^ I don't think the mileage for the western I-88 is right, as it is only near Mile 138 at the connector to southbound I-294.
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mukade

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #18 on: March 17, 2016, 10:13:56 PM »

^ I don't think the mileage for the western I-88 is right, as it is only near Mile 138 at the connector to southbound I-294.

Yes, thanks, I corrected it. But it bolsters the point that there are many short, regional routes. A 250 mile 2 digit Interstate route would not be anywhere near the shortest one.
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Henry

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2016, 11:32:09 AM »

Also, IIRC, there are a few other routes that are competing for the I-67 designation.
I know Kentucky was interested in the I-67 designation at one time, but I believe the latest is that I are thinking about designating the Bowling Green - Owensboro route as I-x65.
There's also the Montgomery-Dothan-Pensacola proposal, and at one time the US 219 upgrade in western PA, but the latter lost out when US 220 was upgraded to I-99. As much as we hate having I-99 where it is now, I-67 in that area would've been much, MUCH worse! :pan:
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jwolfer

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #20 on: March 19, 2016, 01:26:52 PM »

What would be the purpose of it? Traffic from the west will take I-65 to Indy and traffic from the east will take I-69. It'd be a completely regional route, which in my view doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation.

I-65 and I-69 follow completely different directions than US 31. A new I-67 would connect Indianapolis (1.75M metro) to Grand Rapids (1.03M metro) and passing thru South Bend/Elkhart area which is over 500K. Also many 2d Interstate highways are regional routes. I-67, if it were created would be about 250 miles long. Below are the lengths of other 2dis for comparison:

I-17146
I-19102
i-22213
I-27124
I-37143
I-41176
I-43192
i-45285
i-6676
I-68113
I-72184
I-7382
I-78144
I-82144
I-8385
I-84 e232
I-86 w101
I-88 e118
I-88 w141
I-89191
i-96192
I-9718
I-9999

While an Intersate designation would not be necessary, it would be easily justifiable.
I-4 is 132 miles
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Life in Paradise

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #21 on: March 21, 2016, 05:00:17 PM »

What would be the purpose of it? Traffic from the west will take I-65 to Indy and traffic from the east will take I-69. It'd be a completely regional route, which in my view doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation.
Below are the lengths of other 2dis for comparison:

   I-17   146
   I-19   102
   i-22   213
   I-27   124
   I-37   143
   I-41   176
   I-43   192
   i-45   285
   i-66   76
   I-68   113
   I-72   184
   I-73   82
   I-78   144
   I-82   144
   I-83   85
   I-84 e   232
   I-86 w   101
   I-88 e   118
   I-88 w   141
   I-89   191
   i-96   192
   I-97   18
   I-99   99


While an Intersate designation would not be necessary, it would be easily justifiable.
  I-19 was in kilometers, so it would be just over 60 miles.  I-12 is not listed, and it's a glorified 3-d bypass of about 85 miles.
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cabiness42

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #22 on: March 22, 2016, 07:57:11 AM »

US 31 from Plymouth to Peru flows very well.  To me, it would be a lot of unnecessary expense to convert that section just to be able to get an interstate designation.  There are many other projects that are much more important and need to be priorities over that.  If you want to convert the rest of what isn't done from Peru to Noblesville, I'd be fine with that and then that part could be called I-365. 

The flip side is that this section would also be the cheapest to upgrade. There are very few, if any, driveways on the road between US 24 and US 30. They would need five or six interchanges, quite a few overpasses (but this area is very lightly populated), and a bridge over that one railroad near Plymouth. So to me, the question is more about the value received from doing it.

South of US 24 to Kokomo will be much more problematic just like Tipton County.

Even if it would be relatively inexpensive, I just can't justify doing it when there are much more critical projects that need to be done, like making I-65 6 lanes.  Once I pass the last stoplight at Peru heading north, I rarely have to let off the cruise control even once before hitting Plymouth.  It's just not worth the money at any cost.
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roadman65

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #23 on: March 22, 2016, 08:44:38 AM »

What would be the purpose of it? Traffic from the west will take I-65 to Indy and traffic from the east will take I-69. It'd be a completely regional route, which in my view doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation.
Below are the lengths of other 2dis for comparison:

   I-17   146
   I-19   102
   i-22   213
   I-27   124
   I-37   143
   I-41   176
   I-43   192
   i-45   285
   i-66   76
   I-68   113
   I-72   184
   I-73   82
   I-78   144
   I-82   144
   I-83   85
   I-84 e   232
   I-86 w   101
   I-88 e   118
   I-88 w   141
   I-89   191
   i-96   192
   I-97   18
   I-99   99


While an Intersate designation would not be necessary, it would be easily justifiable.
  I-19 was in kilometers, so it would be just over 60 miles.  I-12 is not listed, and it's a glorified 3-d bypass of about 85 miles.
Do not forget I-2 in Texas.  Its just about over 46 miles long.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2016, 08:47:22 AM by roadman65 »
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Henry

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Re: US 31 --> I-67 ?
« Reply #24 on: March 22, 2016, 10:17:43 AM »

What would be the purpose of it? Traffic from the west will take I-65 to Indy and traffic from the east will take I-69. It'd be a completely regional route, which in my view doesn't necessitate an Interstate designation.
Below are the lengths of other 2dis for comparison:

   I-17   146
   I-19   102
   i-22   213
   I-27   124
   I-37   143
   I-41   176
   I-43   192
   i-45   285
   i-66   76
   I-68   113
   I-72   184
   I-73   82
   I-78   144
   I-82   144
   I-83   85
   I-84 e   232
   I-86 w   101
   I-88 e   118
   I-88 w   141
   I-89   191
   i-96   192
   I-97   18
   I-99   99


While an Intersate designation would not be necessary, it would be easily justifiable.
  I-19 was in kilometers, so it would be just over 60 miles.  I-12 is not listed, and it's a glorified 3-d bypass of about 85 miles.
Do not forget I-2 in Texas.  Its just about over 46 miles long.
By comparison, I-476 in PA is 129 miles long, and that's longer than eleven 2di's!
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