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Author Topic: Iowa Interstate Change  (Read 9585 times)

US71

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Iowa Interstate Change
« on: October 14, 2019, 06:49:18 PM »

https://www.wowt.com/content/news/Northern-tier-of-I-680-to-be-renamed-I-880-563078321.html

The Iowa Department of Transportation has re-designated part of I-680 to I-880 between I-29 near Loveland and I-80 near Neola.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2019, 07:39:04 PM »

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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2019, 08:29:29 PM »

A bit of discussion over the past couple weeks on another thread.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2019, 12:46:11 AM »

That's interesting, but makes sense.

Is Iowa DOT planning any changes at the I-680 and I-80 (Crescent) interchange? I thought I remember reading about a modification, but I can't find it, and am also tired.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2019, 07:13:44 AM »

I'm still not sure why they did this.  A flooding event is an emergency situation whereby temporary detour signs need to be posted to cover the area affected.  Standard routings should not IMO be changed for such a reason.

So now instead of having a I-680 alternate/bypass to I-80 thru the Omaha area, 3 different routes need to be followed.   Why?
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2019, 08:25:41 AM »

IowaDOT finally mentioned it yesterday afternoon, but the news release URL referenced does not work:

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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2019, 09:35:30 AM »

I will reiterate that splitting the current I-680 into two segments makes sense, because that gets rid of the pointless and unnecessary concurrency with I-29 (which is also a needless waste of a great 3di). Thus, I support making the Loveland-Minden stretch into I-880.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2019, 12:38:20 PM »

I will reiterate that splitting the current I-680 into two segments makes sense, because that gets rid of the pointless and unnecessary concurrency with I-29 (which is also a needless waste of a great 3di). Thus, I support making the Loveland-Minden stretch into I-880.

The I-29 overlap is part of the Interstate bypass of the area for I-80, and will remain so.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2019, 01:14:12 PM »

I'm still not sure why they did this.  A flooding event is an emergency situation whereby temporary detour signs need to be posted to cover the area affected.  Standard routings should not IMO be changed for such a reason.

So now instead of having a I-680 alternate/bypass to I-80 thru the Omaha area, 3 different routes need to be followed.   Why?
Let's say you're heading on I-29 north.  There's a sign saying a portion of I-29 is closed for flooding (as happens often these days) and to take I-80 and I-680 to detour around it.  Which way do you go?  Now the sign can say I-880, and people won't go the other way and then get stuck when they hit the closure.

Bear in mind that I-680 wasn't ever conceived of as some grand bypass of Omaha.  It was originally designated only on the portion where it exists now.  I-880 was I-80N.  This is actually a return to how everything was originally designated (or as much as one can without bringing back suffixes).  I think someone even posted here (or elsewhere) that they took I-680 around Omaha for a recent trip and didn't find that it would be worth bothering to do unless one needed to make a stop on that route.  It's faster to just stay on I-80 even though there's currently a closure on the mainline at the eastern I-29 interchange.
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mvak36

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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2019, 01:33:30 PM »


Bear in mind that I-680 wasn't ever conceived of as some grand bypass of Omaha.  It was originally designated only on the portion where it exists now.  I-880 was I-80N.  This is actually a return to how everything was originally designated (or as much as one can without bringing back suffixes).  I think someone even posted here (or elsewhere) that they took I-680 around Omaha for a recent trip and didn't find that it would be worth bothering to do unless one needed to make a stop on that route.  It's faster to just stay on I-80 even though there's currently a closure on the mainline at the eastern I-29 interchange.

Yes. 80 is usually the faster route. When I lived in Omaha, I would only take 680 the whole way if I was starting north of Maple or Dodge St. To me, it felt like most of the people taking that route into Iowa were going to continue north on 29 towards Sioux City rather than heading east towards I-80.
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Beltway

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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2019, 01:37:00 PM »

I'm still not sure why they did this.  A flooding event is an emergency situation whereby temporary detour signs need to be posted to cover the area affected.  Standard routings should not IMO be changed for such a reason.
So now instead of having a I-680 alternate/bypass to I-80 thru the Omaha area, 3 different routes need to be followed.   Why?
Let's say you're heading on I-29 north.  There's a sign saying a portion of I-29 is closed for flooding (as happens often these days)
How often is that, how many days, in an average year?  If it is 'often' then they need to plan to build levees, or relocate that part of I-29, or elevate it, and make it as near floodproof as possible.

and to take I-80 and I-680 to detour around it.  Which way do you go?  Now the sign can say I-880, and people won't go the other way and then get stuck when they hit the closure.
What if a section of I-80 or I-680 is flooded?  Depends on the situation at hand.

In your situation, they could post orange trailblazer signs that route "Detour I-29" over I-80 and I-680.

Bear in mind that I-680 wasn't ever conceived of as some grand bypass of Omaha.  It was originally designated only on the portion where it exists now.  I-880 was I-80N.  This is
When was the change, in the mid-1970s when suffixed routes were being renumbered nationwide?

actually a return to how everything was originally designated (or as much as one can without bringing back suffixes).  I think someone even posted here (or elsewhere) that they took I-680 around Omaha for a recent trip and didn't find that it would be worth bothering to do unless one needed to make a stop on that route.  It's faster to just stay on I-80 even though there's currently a closure on the mainline at the eastern I-29 interchange.
Those segments were authorized back to 1950s.  Traffic volumes today are to the point where many metros need outer bypasses, if they are feasible to build.
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vdeane

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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2019, 01:40:53 PM »

When was the change, in the mid-1970s when suffixed routes were being renumbered nationwide?
Yeah, around 1974 according to Wikipedia.
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triplemultiplex

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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2019, 03:54:42 PM »

My knee jerk reaction was against it, but then I'm like, "Where else is Iowa gonna use another even x80?"  Des Moines can use x35's for any current (nudge, nudge) or future loops.  Iowa City and the Quads won't need more freeways this century, so fudge it.  Long live 880.

Furthermore, the Avenue of the Saints is a future 2di waiting in the wings, so that gives a place like Cedar Rapids a new parent for any current or future loops.  My fictional ideas are all still valid.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2019, 03:57:54 PM by triplemultiplex »
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2019, 06:23:01 PM »

I will reiterate that splitting the current I-680 into two segments makes sense, because that gets rid of the pointless and unnecessary concurrency with I-29 (which is also a needless waste of a great 3di). Thus, I support making the Loveland-Minden stretch into I-880.

The I-29 overlap is part of the Interstate bypass of the area for I-80, and will remain so.
I wouldn't really call it a bypass, as both routings traverse about 13 - 15 miles of urban area. Both routings are completely rural north of there, and I-80 is shorter distance than I-680. The only difference is I-680 bypasses the core Downtown area, but it still goes through the urban / traffic dense area nonetheless.

If I was traveling through the area, I'd probably remain on I-80 fully. I don't image much thru traffic would use that northern routing, unless there was traffic congestion on I-80 and none of I-680.

Now, if I-680 traveled through a completely rural area or suburban area with good interchange spacing, a lot of lanes, rural design on the facility itself, etc. (think I-295 around the outer Richmond suburbs in VA) and avoided all of the urban area, then it's a no-brainer to take that. But that's not the case.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2019, 06:27:44 PM by sprjus4 »
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2019, 08:39:58 PM »

So I wonder why they routed I-680 that way 40 years ago after I-80N was changed to I-680?  Other than seeing I-680 as a bypass/alternate to I-80 thru Omaha?
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #15 on: October 15, 2019, 10:47:51 PM »

When was the change, in the mid-1970s when suffixed routes were being renumbered nationwide?
Yeah, around 1974 according to Wikipedia.

Approved by AASHTO on November 10, 1973:

Quote
I-80N
Redesignation

Approved

Beginning at the intersection of I-680, I-29 and I-80N at the Crescent interchange, thence northerly overlapping I-29 and U.S. 75 to the interchange with present I-80N at Loveland, thence in an easterly direction overlapping I-80N to the intersection of present I-80 at Neola. Existing route I-80N to be redesignated I-680.

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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2019, 10:02:52 PM »

Well that was fast. They've updated it to I-880 on Google Maps (at least the icon). The part concurrent with I-29 still shows I-680 and if you do directions from Crescent Iowa to the I-80/I-880 interchange near Minden it still gives the directions for the I-880 part as I-680.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #17 on: October 17, 2019, 12:14:28 PM »

Well that was fast. They've updated it to I-880 on Google Maps (at least the icon). The part concurrent with I-29 still shows I-680 and if you do directions from Crescent Iowa to the I-80/I-880 interchange near Minden it still gives the directions for the I-880 part as I-680.
All of Street View still labels it as I-680, even with the little map in the corner showing I-880. Guess we have to wait for them to drive it again.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #18 on: October 17, 2019, 02:48:34 PM »

Well that was fast. They've updated it to I-880 on Google Maps (at least the icon). The part concurrent with I-29 still shows I-680 and if you do directions from Crescent Iowa to the I-80/I-880 interchange near Minden it still gives the directions for the I-880 part as I-680.
All of Street View still labels it as I-680, even with the little map in the corner showing I-880. Guess we have to wait for them to drive it again.

Here maps should already have it updated, though I've not checked.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #19 on: October 17, 2019, 04:17:13 PM »

Why didn't they do this when the Interstate 80N designation was decommissioned in the 1970s? Personally, I think they should leave the existing 680 designation along this segment alone, and not renumber it to 880, even if no other roadway in Iowa would ever bear the 880 designation.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2019, 11:22:29 PM »

Why didn't they do this when the Interstate 80N designation was decommissioned in the 1970s? Personally, I think they should leave the existing 680 designation along this segment alone, and not renumber it to 880, even if no other roadway in Iowa would ever bear the 880 designation.

Missouri River wasn't flooding on a regular basis back then.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #21 on: October 18, 2019, 12:03:16 AM »

Why didn't they do this when the Interstate 80N designation was decommissioned in the 1970s? Personally, I think they should leave the existing 680 designation along this segment alone, and not renumber it to 880, even if no other roadway in Iowa would ever bear the 880 designation.
Missouri River wasn't flooding on a regular basis back then.

How many days per year does it flood?
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #22 on: October 18, 2019, 07:34:30 AM »

Why didn't they do this when the Interstate 80N designation was decommissioned in the 1970s? Personally, I think they should leave the existing 680 designation along this segment alone, and not renumber it to 880, even if no other roadway in Iowa would ever bear the 880 designation.
Missouri River wasn't flooding on a regular basis back then.

How many days per year does it flood?


Most years, not at all. Before this unusual year, the last flood was in 2011. Before that, sometime in the 1950's, prior to the 4 upstream dams in South Dakota being completed. The combination of the Spencer Dam on the Niobrara River failing in March, along with unusually wet weather that lasted into September, is the reason you're seeing I-29 and IA 2 (among others) being closed for lengthy periods of time on up to 4 separate occasions.
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #23 on: October 18, 2019, 01:51:39 PM »

Google Maps already shows old 680 as 880. In any event, how soon will old 680's exit numbers remain the same? By my estimates, the new exit numbers will go as follows:

Interstate 29 South-Exit 0A or 1A
Interstate 29 North-Exit 0B or 1B
County L34-Old Exit 21/New Exit 8
IA 191 North/County G8L South-Old Exit 28/New Exit 15
Interstate 80 East-Old Exit 29A/New Exit 16A
Interstate 80 West-Old Exit 29B/New Exit 16B
« Last Edit: October 18, 2019, 03:31:57 PM by The Ghostbuster »
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Re: Iowa Interstate Change
« Reply #24 on: October 18, 2019, 02:21:18 PM »

Given this map, the numbers might not change at all.
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