SC Speed Cameras

[realjd]

I just wanted to warn y'all - on I-95 in SC, not too far north of the GA border, there are speed cameras set up. I drove my them today. Looking on Google News, it's a small town looking for revenue. Apparently SC passed a law banning speed cameras because of this town and their shenanigans, but the town said FU to the state and is still issuing photo tickets.

I think I was going less than the 10 mph tolerance when I passed the camera, but if I get a ticket I don't intend to pay it.

[Brandon]

I just wanted to warn y'all - on I-95 in SC, not too far north of the GA border, there are speed cameras set up. I drove my them today. Looking on Google News, it's a small town looking for revenue. Apparently SC passed a law banning speed cameras because of this town and their shenanigans, but the town said FU to the state and is still issuing photo tickets.

I think I was going less than the 10 mph tolerance when I passed the camera, but if I get a ticket I don't intend to pay it.

If speed cameras are illegal in the state, one can tell the town FU and safely ignore the ticket.  I'd report any tickets issued to the SC state police.

[D-Dey65]

Roughly how far from the Georgia border is this?

[Truvelo]

Roughly how far from the Georgia border is this?

This site has an article about a town called Ridgeland which is about 20 miles from the border. It's currently the second article on the page as I type this.

[SP Cook]

If a town is issuing tickets in violation of the law (and, of course, all non-human photo enforcement violates the Constitution and will eventually be banned nationwide) everyone involved should be sued in their personal capacity and reduced to poverty.

[stormwatch7721]

Lawsuit has been filed about those cameras, according to local news sources.

[realjd]

They were out again yesterday when I was driving home. The cameras were set up in a different location but still in the same general area. This time they were near MM 21.

[deathtopumpkins]

Ridgeland, SC's speed cameras got a feature on Yahoo! News today: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110327/ap_on_re_us/us_speed_camera_spat

[agentsteel53]

Ridgeland, SC's speed cameras got a feature on Yahoo! News today: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110327/ap_on_re_us/us_speed_camera_spat

No ticket is issued if there is any question about the driver's identity.

BRB costume shop... it would be kinda amusing to drive through South Carolina wearing, say, a fake moustache, a Ted Kennedy mask, or perhaps a giraffe suit.

[rickmastfan67]

Ridgeland, SC's speed cameras got a feature on Yahoo! News today: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110327/ap_on_re_us/us_speed_camera_spat

The AP has been passing out this story out to everybody today.  I've seen it on MSNBC and iWon as well.

[realjd]

My problem with these isn't necessarily a privacy issue. It's the fact that they are clearly out not to improve public safety but to generate revenue.

In the UK, where there are speed cameras seemingly every 100 yards, the cameras are well marked. It's clear that they are there to promote safety because they don't try to hide them. They all had signs leading up to the camera, then signs right near the camera, often with the speed limit reinforced on the camera sign. And people slowed down for them.

In SC, they have a tiny blue-on-white sign in the median indicating that speed cameras are ahead, then the cameras consist of a small mobile tripod on the side of the road connected to a van hiding nearby. If they were serious about promoting public safety, they'd mark them better. Or at least use more noticeable warning signs. Blue on white isn't even a proper color, and the median isn't the right place for them. On NB I-95, they even partially hid the warning sign behind an overpass support.

[wriddle082]

I drove by the Ridgeland cameras when the family and I were coming home from Florida on Sunday.  They were pointed at the northbound lanes underneath an overpass in a shady area just before the exit where US 17 starts its multiplex with I-95.  As soon as I saw them, I looked down at the speedometer and I was doing 73, so we'll see if anything happens.

[deathtopumpkins]

In the article I linked to the mayor (IIRC) of the town is quoted as saying that the cameras don't trigger unless you're doing 80, so you should be fine.

[rickmastfan67]

In the article I linked to the mayor (IIRC) of the town is quoted as saying that the cameras don't trigger unless you're doing 80, so you should be fine.

What he really means is they trigger @ 70.0000005 MPH. lol.  Since when has a mayor not lied about something like this?  I wouldn't feel safe on I-95 in that area unless going 65 MPH.

[realjd]

The first time I drove by I was going 76 and it didn't give me a ticket.

[agentsteel53]

What he really means is they trigger @ 70.0000005 MPH. lol.  Since when has a mayor not lied about something like this?  I wouldn't feel safe on I-95 in that area unless going 65 MPH.

I wouldn't feel safe going over 0 mph.  Your word vs theirs. 

[Brandon]

What he really means is they trigger @ 70.0000005 MPH. lol.  Since when has a mayor not lied about something like this?  I wouldn't feel safe on I-95 in that area unless going 65 MPH.

I wouldn't feel safe going over 0 mph.  Your word vs theirs. 

Since it is a municipality doing this in spite of SC law and the SC legislature, I would report any ticket sent to me by them to the SC state police and refuse to pay it.

[agentsteel53]

Since it is a municipality doing this in spite of SC law and the SC legislature, I would report any ticket sent to me by them to the SC state police and refuse to pay it.

you're complaining about the government to ... the government.  yeah, that's gonna work real well.

[Brandon]

Since it is a municipality doing this in spite of SC law and the SC legislature, I would report any ticket sent to me by them to the SC state police and refuse to pay it.

you're complaining about the government to ... the government.  yeah, that's gonna work real well.

Be surprised.  It's state government vs. rouge municipal government.  The state is already pissed off enough at Ridgeland as it is right now.  States can both make and break municipalities (see New Rome, Ohio as an example) over issues like this.

[Jerseyman4]

More than likely, Gov Haley will pull the plug on its speed camera enforcement that will prohibit automated speed enforcement. I can see Ridgeland getting pissed off with this. Would not surprise me if they become a Waldo, Lawtey or Starke, Florida by having every municipal police officer at every median cut on its 8 mile POS jurisdiction on I-95 to punish drivers for going 1mph over the speed limit.

[SidS1045]

I wouldn't feel safe going over 0 mph.  Your word vs theirs. 

...and that is precisely the crux of the matter.  If the amount in question is over $20, all the constitutional protections apply, so ask to cross-examine the camera in open court.  It is, after all, the principal witness against you.

And yes, I realize that speeding past a camera is probably a "civil infraction" or some other nonsensical shorthand for "just pay the money so we don't have to try you."  Never mind that.  Make them prove it.  If enough people did that, those cameras and all the other unconstitutional crap would disappear.

[agentsteel53]

...and that is precisely the crux of the matter.  If the amount in question is over $20, all the constitutional protections apply, so ask to cross-examine the camera in open court.  It is, after all, the principal witness against you.

And yes, I realize that speeding past a camera is probably a "civil infraction" or some other nonsensical shorthand for "just pay the money so we don't have to try you."  Never mind that.  Make them prove it.  If enough people did that, those cameras and all the other unconstitutional crap would disappear.

and how much does it cost me to retain a lawyer who has the necessary skills to cross-examine the camera competently?  probably several hundred to over a thousand bucks. 

either that or I do the cross-examination myself, which implies I'd have to fly back to South Carolina, which is an airfare and likely days off from work... also several hundred to over a thousand bucks.

question is - how much does the ticket cause my insurance rates to rise over the next 5 or so years before it drops off my record?  that, combined with the fee itself, is what has to be weighed against the costs of fighting the ticket (divided, of course, by the probability of success!) - it simply may make economic sense to bend over and pay the fine.

[1995hoo]

More than likely, Gov Haley will pull the plug on its speed camera enforcement that will prohibit automated speed enforcement. I can see Ridgeland getting pissed off with this. Would not surprise me if they become a Waldo, Lawtey or Starke, Florida by having every municipal police officer at every median cut on its 8 mile POS jurisdiction on I-95 to punish drivers for going 1mph over the speed limit.

When we passed through there on July 2 they had several cop cars out and a cop standing on an overpass with a radar gun and a hand-held radio.

[ShawnP]

If I were the state. I would pull their ability to be a city right from under them. Then I would post the names and addresses of every city official and police officer involved in this scheme.

[mtantillo]

question is - how much does the ticket cause my insurance rates to rise over the next 5 or so years before it drops off my record?

The good thing about speed camera and red light camera fines is that there are typically no points or derogatory information added to a driving record, because they only know that the vehicle was speeding, not who was driving it. 

Its very easy to pass a law saying "vehicle owner is responsible for fines of that vehicle is caught speeding", and the burden of proof is easy...just a camera showing a speeding vehicle (a properly calibrated camera can snap two pics in a row and the speed can be computed from the distance travelled in that time, and the vehicle can be identified with the license plate).  But to actually nail the driver, the burden of proof becomes much more difficult, if not impossible.  Since speed cams are much more about revenue than driver safety, who cares about points or driving records as long as the jurisdiction gets their money? 

I had a friend get pulled over for doing 20 over in Greenville, SC on I-85 (well known speed trap).  Cop wrote him a ticket.  Said he could plead not guilty and show up in court, he could pay the full fine to the state and get 4 points, or he could instead send the full fine and ticket to the county judge (address scribbled in pencil on the back of the ticket by the officers) and the judge would only give him two points.    See, all about money...you pay the state, you get nailed, you pay us, we'll cut you a deal.  I advised my friend to pay the state, as New York State (where we were both licensed to drive) does not assign any points for violations occurring outside of New York, Quebec, or Ontario (the latter two by special reciprocal agreement, mostly so those two provinces can get violation info from New York State).