Interstate 11

[Rothman]

There is zero need to have two Interstate highways going down to Nogales. Out of all the pork barrel proposals for highways being floated nationwide, that's one of the most needless. Existing I-19 is 2 lanes in each direction nearly its entire length. It could be widened from a 2x2 to a 4x4 or even 5x5 configuration within the existing ROW.

I could maybe see I-11 being extended down to the Tucson area in part as a relief route for I-10 and bypass around Tucson to I-19. But since there is generally so much anti-roads opposition in the Tucson area why even bother with any of that. Let Tucson suffocate in stoplight hell as their city continues to sprawl. Divert the highway funding to more worthwhile efforts.

I am not sure why Interstate 11 is going to Nogales though despite it being a part of the CANAMEX corridor. In fact I'd rather prefer one to Lukeville, although there is no need for such.

Egads.  Why would you prefer that?  An interstate through a national monument to a dinky town on the border in which my father used to live...

[Zonie]

And an Air Force bombing range...

[vdeane]

The I-11 proposal/plan in Arizona is nothing about a Phoenix or Tucson bypass for the local/regional population like AZDOT or other public officials are trying to sell it.  For everyone saying "we were told only Phoenix to Vegas", you need to Google "Canamex Corridor".  Look for the maps and research when the corridor was first PUBLICLY proposed.  I-11 from Phoenix to Vegas was the bait and switch for a new superhighway/interstate to further facilitate the overall NAFTA agenda.  McCain and other politicians have been planning since the 90s to have an interstate run from Nogales to Vegas to connect to I-15 and ultimately to the Canadian border for corporate interests.

When you see the overall picture, the Record of Decision makes perfect sense: I-11 is not about being a new part of the interstate system connecting two close large metropolitan areas, but a NAFTA superhighway connecting Mexico and Canada.  The NAFTA name has since gone by the wayside but the intent is still the same by globalist aligned politicians in BOTH parties who play us like fiddles.  We can only trust politicians to lie to us and serve the interests that make them money, and we need to understand that this extends to transportation planning along with nearly every facet of our lives.  If you think this is opinion, then you are not paying attention and need to wake up.

I-11 running from Vegas to Reno is merely a tangent by NVDOT and not necessarily a part of the overall globalist agenda.  At the time of the Canamex Corridor proposal the plan by the globalists was the integration of the North American countries to form the North American Union, and connecting superhighways were a major part of this serving future business interests via paid off politicians pushing things like this in the interim.  We can debate whether this is still a plan that is no longer publicly talked about, but when we see governments across the world working in lockstep to overblow COVID in order to take away our rights for assumed ends, we should be able to see the real enemy and put our political differences aside to figure out what the hell is really going on. 

Back on track, it is logical that if the full proposal comes to fruition in Pima County then the I-19 designation would be dropped and we will likely see the only 3DI in Arizona for the remainder of I-19 running from I-11 to I-10.  If this happens the metric system signage would likely be dropped with the resigning to I-11.  In doing so, I-11 would connect to the most access-controlled / superhighway route to Mexico City from the western US, and THAT is the whole point of the ROD routing.

That doesn't explain why these corridors all need to have a uniform number, though.  The interstate system already connects Mexico to Canada.  Sure, there are some gaps that should be filled in, but there's no need for "NAFTA Superhighways".  Why does everybody only think of corridors rather than systems these days?  In any case, Canamex would still have more than one number, since I doubt they're renumbering or re-routing I-15.  What's wrong with leaving Canamex as just a name and letting I-11 be the connector between I-15 and I-19/I-10?  Although at least I-11 will probably get built, unlike I-69, which is turning into another I-74.

As for a North American Union, if that's what they're going for, all the times they've thickened the border since 9/11 would be counter-productive for that.  Crossing the border used to be easy.  Now it requires a passport and for one to endure an interrogation during which the border guard makes you feel like you're wrong for crossing that line on the map (after waiting a while in line), at best.  Even NEXUS just gets you back to the way things were in the 90s, for a fee and lots of red tape and background checks.  They also don't seem to be doing a great job of integrating the freeways of the US, Canada, and Mexico into a grand system - in fact, even if Canada were interested in extending the interstates into its country, it would be nearly universally unable to, since most freeways that go to the border don't meet the same standards approaching/leaving the border that the interstates do.  And Mexico doesn't even have anything resembling the interstate system.  Plus the different responses to COVID would seem to bring us further apart, not closer together.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

There is zero need to have two Interstate highways going down to Nogales. Out of all the pork barrel proposals for highways being floated nationwide, that's one of the most needless. Existing I-19 is 2 lanes in each direction nearly its entire length. It could be widened from a 2x2 to a 4x4 or even 5x5 configuration within the existing ROW.

I could maybe see I-11 being extended down to the Tucson area in part as a relief route for I-10 and bypass around Tucson to I-19. But since there is generally so much anti-roads opposition in the Tucson area why even bother with any of that. Let Tucson suffocate in stoplight hell as their city continues to sprawl. Divert the highway funding to more worthwhile efforts.

I am not sure why Interstate 11 is going to Nogales though despite it being a part of the CANAMEX corridor. In fact I'd rather prefer one to Lukeville, although there is no need for such.

Egads.  Why would you prefer that?  An interstate through a national monument to a dinky town on the border in which my father used to live...

Well I wasn't sure why I-11 would be needed south of Phoenix, essentially making a concurrency along I-10 and possibly eliminating I-19 in the process. It wouldn't run through the reservation to the east of the monument either.

[Plutonic Panda]

This whole interstate just isn't right. It doesn't serve Phoenix to Vegas traffic unless you're out on the far flung westside and goes way the hell east out of Reno instead of connecting to I-580 in Carson City which it should. I really planners rethink this crap proposal before it gets built. At least in the near future the section from Kingman to NV state line is sensible and needed.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

This whole interstate just isn't right. It doesn't serve Phoenix to Vegas traffic unless you're out on the far flung westside and goes way the hell east out of Reno instead of connecting to I-580 in Carson City which it should. I really planners rethink this crap proposal before it gets built. At least in the near future the section from Kingman to NV state line is sensible and needed.

I thought it would go down US 60 to SR 303 loop and to end at I-10, since it's mostly low density over there.

[Plutonic Panda]

This whole interstate just isn't right. It doesn't serve Phoenix to Vegas traffic unless you're out on the far flung westside and goes way the hell east out of Reno instead of connecting to I-580 in Carson City which it should. I really planners rethink this crap proposal before it gets built. At least in the near future the section from Kingman to NV state line is sensible and needed.

I thought it would go down US 60 to SR 303 loop and to end at I-10, since it's mostly low density over there.

You mean the segment of I-10 south of Phoenix? Not the segment west because a loop is justified there. To clarify, I am not at all against building the proposed freeways I-11 is planned to be signed on just the fact I-11 will be signed on them. I say still build the freeways but connect I-11 directly from downtown Phoenix to Las Vegas and then DTLV to Reno via connecting I-580 at Carson City and renumbering that road obviously. The latter was ruled by NDOT as being cost prohibitive so now they are proposing I-11 to connect way east of Reno at I-80. It's a joke.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

This whole interstate just isn't right. It doesn't serve Phoenix to Vegas traffic unless you're out on the far flung westside and goes way the hell east out of Reno instead of connecting to I-580 in Carson City which it should. I really planners rethink this crap proposal before it gets built. At least in the near future the section from Kingman to NV state line is sensible and needed.

I thought it would go down US 60 to SR 303 loop and to end at I-10, since it's mostly low density over there.

You mean the segment of I-10 south of Phoenix? Not the segment west because a loop is justified there. To clarify, I am not at all against building the proposed freeways I-11 is planned to be signed on just the fact I-11 will be signed on them. I say still build the freeways but connect I-11 directly from downtown Phoenix to Las Vegas and then DTLV to Reno via connecting I-580 at Carson City and renumbering that road obviously. The latter was ruled by NDOT as being cost prohibitive so now they are proposing I-11 to connect way east of Reno at I-80. It's a joke.

I first read I-11 as a Las Vegas to Phoenix route with a possible northward extension to Reno, which I get entirely. What I don't get is building another freeway south of Phoenix to Nogales which is covered by both I-10 and I-19. However, there's AZ 85 that have yet be upgraded as well.

[Plutonic Panda]

This whole interstate just isn't right. It doesn't serve Phoenix to Vegas traffic unless you're out on the far flung westside and goes way the hell east out of Reno instead of connecting to I-580 in Carson City which it should. I really planners rethink this crap proposal before it gets built. At least in the near future the section from Kingman to NV state line is sensible and needed.

I thought it would go down US 60 to SR 303 loop and to end at I-10, since it's mostly low density over there.

You mean the segment of I-10 south of Phoenix? Not the segment west because a loop is justified there. To clarify, I am not at all against building the proposed freeways I-11 is planned to be signed on just the fact I-11 will be signed on them. I say still build the freeways but connect I-11 directly from downtown Phoenix to Las Vegas and then DTLV to Reno via connecting I-580 at Carson City and renumbering that road obviously. The latter was ruled by NDOT as being cost prohibitive so now they are proposing I-11 to connect way east of Reno at I-80. It's a joke.

I first read I-11 as a Las Vegas to Phoenix route with a possible northward extension to Reno, which I get entirely. What I don't get is building another freeway south of Phoenix to Nogales which is covered by both I-10 and I-19. However, there's AZ 85 that have yet be upgraded as well.

I was thinking of a bypass around Estrella Mountain in the far SW connecting to I-8. But yeah I-11 to the border is just stupid. That might just be the most ridiculous road idea in the states with a serious proposal atm.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

And an Air Force bombing range...

Which bombing range? All I see is shooting ranges

[Bobby5280]

The CANAMEX/NAFTA corridor sales pitch is really pretty laughable. How is such a corridor supposed to attract giant volumes of international commercial trucking traffic with such a freakishly crooked corridor?

A bunch of the distorted twists and bends of this proposed "I-11" thing is really doing more to serve real estate speculator interests than anything else. That's what that stupid path way out West of the White Tanks is about. Build a new freeway out there and a bunch of over-priced housing development projects will follow. There is no other purpose for it than that.

I-11 below I-10 is a solution in search of a problem. How much traffic flows on I-19 currently? Nearly all of it is just 2x2 lanes. If traffic were truly heavy enough to warrant building a second Interstate highway parallel to I-19 the existing I-19 highway would have had to be widened numerous times by now and still bursting at the seams with traffic. Well, it isn't. I-11 would be best as a Vegas-Phoenix corridor (and maybe Reno someday). All the other distractions and misdirections of proposed I-11 are efforts chasing after pork funding.

Which bombing range? All I see is shooting ranges

Luke Air Force Range (aka Barry M. Goldwater Air Force Range) is pretty gigantic.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

The CANAMEX/NAFTA corridor sales pitch is really pretty laughable. How is such a corridor supposed to attract giant volumes of international commercial trucking traffic with such a freakishly crooked corridor?

A bunch of the distorted twists and bends of this proposed "I-11" thing is really doing more to serve real estate speculator interests than anything else. That's what that stupid path way out West of the White Tanks is about. Build a new freeway out there and a bunch of over-priced housing development projects will follow. There is no other purpose for it than that.

I-11 below I-10 is a solution in search of a problem. How much traffic flows on I-19 currently? Nearly all of it is just 2x2 lanes. If traffic were truly heavy enough to warrant building a second Interstate highway parallel I-19 the existing I-19 would have had to be widened numerous times by now and still bursting at the seams with traffic. Well, it isn't. I-11 would be best as a Vegas-Phoenix corridor (and maybe Reno someday). All the other distractions and misdirections of proposed I-11 are efforts chasing after pork funding.

Which bombing range? All I see is shooting ranges

Luke Air Force Range (aka Barry M. Goldwater Air Force Range) is pretty gigantic.

I just noticed it covered a half of AZ 85's length south of I-8. 

[kernals12]

I am going to be furious if they do not turn the other half of AZ 85 into a freeway and then designate it as Interstate 711.

[Max Rockatansky]

I am going to be furious if they do not turn the other half of AZ 85 into a freeway and then designate it as Interstate 711.

Why?  It's not like any of these designations are chargeable anymore. 

[kernals12]

I am going to be furious if they do not turn the other half of AZ 85 into a freeway and then designate it as Interstate 711.

Why?  It's not like any of these designations are chargeable anymore.

It's a joke

[Max Rockatansky]

I am going to be furious if they do not turn the other half of AZ 85 into a freeway and then designate it as Interstate 711.

Why?  It's not like any of these designations are chargeable anymore.

It's a joke

But it also raises an interesting point of conjecture.  Unsubstantiated word on the street is that's why the Loop Freeways are signed as State Highways.  Apparently there might have been some lingering bitterness at ADOT towards the FHWA for the total lack of chargeable three digit Interstates. 

[hotdogPi]

It's a joke

This is why I've started using strikethrough text as seen on Discord and Reddit (and probably exists on other sites).

Side note: people have used /s to mean sarcasm for years, and BBcode uses /s in brackets as a strikethrough tag. There's a hidden connection here.

[vdeane]

Apparently there might have been some lingering bitterness at ADOT towards the FHWA for the total lack of chargeable three digit Interstates. 

Interesting... if I-19 were to be replaced with I-11 and the remainder made a 3di, that would presumably be a chargeable 3di in Arizona... could make for some interesting dynamics.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

The only logical reason that I could see why Interstate 11 going being as fast west as Buckeye is perhaps due to traffic jams on Interstate 10 and 17. But even then, the traffic on Loop 303 appear to be fine.

[kernals12]

The only logical reason that I could see why Interstate 11 going being as fast west as Buckeye is perhaps due to traffic jams on Interstate 10 and 17. But even then, the traffic on Loop 303 appear to be fine.

As I've said several times, developers have big plans for that corridor. Douglas Ranch alone is planned for 300,000 people.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

That's a whole lot of people for one planned community.

[kernals12]

That's a whole lot of people for one planned community.

It's about the same size as Irvine, California.

Phoenix is booming.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

I also managed to find a possibility of a Loop 505 as well from US 60 to Interstate 11 in this PDF.

https://arizonacrew.org/getmedia/d4ecf887-6b56-4640-91d0-086e87066f88/AZCREW-Nov19-Presentation.pdf.aspx

That's a whole lot of people for one planned community.

It's about the same size as Irvine, California.

Wow.

[kernals12]

I also managed to find a possibility of a Loop 505 as well from US 60 to Interstate 11 in this PDF.

https://arizonacrew.org/getmedia/d4ecf887-6b56-4640-91d0-086e87066f88/AZCREW-Nov19-Presentation.pdf.aspx

That's a whole lot of people for one planned community.

It's about the same size as Irvine, California.

Wow.

I have no idea why they would number such a freeway as 505 when there's no 404 anywhere on the map, unless ADOT is worried about sign thefts.

[CoolAngrybirdsrio4]

I also managed to find a possibility of a Loop 505 as well from US 60 to Interstate 11 in this PDF.

https://arizonacrew.org/getmedia/d4ecf887-6b56-4640-91d0-086e87066f88/AZCREW-Nov19-Presentation.pdf.aspx

That's a whole lot of people for one planned community.

It's about the same size as Irvine, California.

Wow.

I have no idea why they would number such a freeway as 505 when there's no 404 anywhere on the map, unless ADOT is worried about sign thefts.

I was wondering about where Loop 404 would go as well within the western Phoenix area or any metro area for that matter.