Virginia

[Beltway]

Same separator as on I-495. 65 mph HOT, 55 mph GP. Difference may be that I-66 is fairly straight, while I-495 has a lot of horizontal curvature.

When they posted 65 on the Beltway, they said they never considered posting 70 mph there.
Edited to add: Here is a WTOP report from 2013 from back when they raised the Beltway express lanes to 65 mph. They said the study showed 70 would have been justifiable but that they recommended against it.

It is near the margin. Even in the old days when most of I-495 was like a rural highway, the highest (nearly all) in Virginia was 65 mph.

[Mapmikey]

This location of the 495 outer loop express lanes is where 70 should be too high:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/c63mQiSfQZwhaRjJ6

On ramps from both sides.  The left one (from VA 267/Dulles Toll Rd) has <1000 ft to merge over while some 495 traffic is trying to make a left exit to Tysons Corner.

About every other week I would be in one lane wanting to move over to allow a merge but could not because someone was also coming down the opposite on-ramp.  Zero right shoulder and a close-to-full lane width left shoulder.

I always think of this location when wondering why 65 mph is not the default limit on urban freeways.

[Pink Jazz]

This location of the 495 outer loop express lanes is where 70 should be too high:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/c63mQiSfQZwhaRjJ6

On ramps from both sides.  The left one (from VA 267/Dulles Toll Rd) has <1000 ft to merge over while some 495 traffic is trying to make a left exit to Tysons Corner.

About every other week I would be in one lane wanting to move over to allow a merge but could not because someone was also coming down the opposite on-ramp.  Zero right shoulder and a close-to-full lane width left shoulder.

I always think of this location when wondering why 65 mph is not the default limit on urban freeways.

Considering that 65 mph is the default limit on urban freeways in most other states (especially in the South and West), VDOT is putting itself at a competitive disadvantage. States like Arizona, Texas, Florida, Georgia, North Carolina, and New Mexico routinely post urban freeways at 65 mph. Almost all of these states have freeway segments with comparable geometry and 85th percentile speeds to I-264 in VB and post them at 60 or 65 mph without compromising safety.

BTW I emailed VDOT about this, but they said I have to be a Virginia resident (I live in Arizona). I visit Hampton Roads a lot to visit my aunt, but unfortunately it has to be under her name. If anyone from Virginia can do me this favor to try to convince VDOT to raise the speed limit, that would be greatly appreciated, and my aunt would also appreciate it.

[1995hoo]

"Competitive disadvantage"? How so? Somehow I can't see anyone saying, "Oh, I-264's speed limit from Virginia Beach to Norfolk is too slow, so I'll use I-17 as an alternate route."

[Pink Jazz]

"Competitive disadvantage"? How so? Somehow I can't see anyone saying, "Oh, I-264's speed limit from Virginia Beach to Norfolk is too slow, so I'll use I-17 as an alternate route."

I mean in comparison to other states that have more forgiving speed limits on comparable highways. This for some people might be a factor in determining quality of life for a specific city.

[Beltway]

Considering that 65 mph is the default limit on urban freeways in most other states (especially in the South and West), VDOT is putting itself at a competitive disadvantage. States like Arizona, Texas, Florida, Georgia, North Carolina, and New Mexico routinely post urban freeways at 65 mph. Almost all of these states have freeway segments with comparable geometry and 85th percentile speeds to I-264 in VB and post them at 60 or 65 mph without compromising safety.
BTW I emailed VDOT about this, but they said I have to be a Virginia resident (I live in Arizona). I visit Hampton Roads a lot to visit my aunt, but unfortunately it has to be under her name. If anyone from Virginia can do me this favor to try to convince VDOT to raise the speed limit, that would be greatly appreciated, and my aunt would also appreciate it.

That is not the VDOT that I know -- they take comments from other states. And NC is right across the border from Hampton Roads. And metro D.C. includes Marykand and Washington.

What do you consider to be an urban freeway in NC?  There is precious little other than I-277 and I-240.

I see plenty of 55mph segments in FL and GA.

Besides, 60 mph limits are present in South Hampton Roads and 60 and 65 mph in Hampton and Newport News.

[WillWeaverRVA]

What do you consider to be an urban freeway in NC?  There is precious little other than I-277 and I-240.

US 29 in Greensboro (posted at 60) and US 52 in Winston-Salem (posted at 55) probably fit the bill but both of them are well below interstate standards. NC 147 in Durham is also posted at 55 and is also fairly substandard.

Granted, I-264 is substandard or barely Interstate standard in Virginia Beach too.

[ElishaGOtis]

This location of the 495 outer loop express lanes is where 70 should be too high:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/c63mQiSfQZwhaRjJ6

On ramps from both sides.  The left one (from VA 267/Dulles Toll Rd) has <1000 ft to merge over while some 495 traffic is trying to make a left exit to Tysons Corner.

About every other week I would be in one lane wanting to move over to allow a merge but could not because someone was also coming down the opposite on-ramp.  Zero right shoulder and a close-to-full lane width left shoulder.

I always think of this location when wondering why 65 mph is not the default limit on urban freeways.

Considering that 65 mph is the default limit on urban freeways in most other states (especially in the South and West), VDOT is putting itself at a competitive disadvantage. States like Arizona, Texas, Florida, Georgia, North Carolina, and New Mexico routinely post urban freeways at 65 mph. Almost all of these states have freeway segments with comparable geometry and 85th percentile speeds to I-264 in VB and post them at 60 or 65 mph without compromising safety.

BTW I emailed VDOT about this, but they said I have to be a Virginia resident (I live in Arizona). I visit Hampton Roads a lot to visit my aunt, but unfortunately it has to be under her name. If anyone from Virginia can do me this favor to try to convince VDOT to raise the speed limit, that would be greatly appreciated, and my aunt would also appreciate it.

Also found this
https://my.vdot.virginia.gov/#0

[1995hoo]

"Competitive disadvantage"? How so? Somehow I can't see anyone saying, "Oh, I-264's speed limit from Virginia Beach to Norfolk is too slow, so I'll use I-17 as an alternate route."

I mean in comparison to other states that have more forgiving speed limits on comparable highways. This for some people might be a factor in determining quality of life for a specific city.

Surely you're trolling at this point.

VDOT's not going to take that sort of thing into account when deciding on speed limits.

[Rothman]

Considering that 65 mph is the default limit on urban freeways in most other states (especially in the South and West), VDOT is putting itself at a competitive disadvantage. States like Arizona, Texas, Florida, Georgia, North Carolina, and New Mexico routinely post urban freeways at 65 mph. Almost all of these states have freeway segments with comparable geometry and 85th percentile speeds to I-264 in VB and post them at 60 or 65 mph without compromising safety.
BTW I emailed VDOT about this, but they said I have to be a Virginia resident (I live in Arizona). I visit Hampton Roads a lot to visit my aunt, but unfortunately it has to be under her name. If anyone from Virginia can do me this favor to try to convince VDOT to raise the speed limit, that would be greatly appreciated, and my aunt would also appreciate it.

That is not the VDOT that I know

Things change over time...

[hbelkins]

Considering that 65 mph is the default limit on urban freeways in most other states (especially in the South and West), VDOT is putting itself at a competitive disadvantage. States like Arizona, Texas, Florida, Georgia, North Carolina, and New Mexico routinely post urban freeways at 65 mph. Almost all of these states have freeway segments with comparable geometry and 85th percentile speeds to I-264 in VB and post them at 60 or 65 mph without compromising safety.
BTW I emailed VDOT about this, but they said I have to be a Virginia resident (I live in Arizona). I visit Hampton Roads a lot to visit my aunt, but unfortunately it has to be under her name. If anyone from Virginia can do me this favor to try to convince VDOT to raise the speed limit, that would be greatly appreciated, and my aunt would also appreciate it.

That is not the VDOT that I know -- they take comments from other states. And NC is right across the border from Hampton Roads. And metro D.C. includes Marykand and Washington.

What do you consider to be an urban freeway in NC?  There is precious little other than I-277 and I-240.

I see plenty of 55mph segments in FL and GA.

Besides, 60 mph limits are present in South Hampton Roads and 60 and 65 mph in Hampton and Newport News.

Considering that 65 mph is the default limit on urban freeways in most other states (especially in the South and West), VDOT is putting itself at a competitive disadvantage. States like Arizona, Texas, Florida, Georgia, North Carolina, and New Mexico routinely post urban freeways at 65 mph. Almost all of these states have freeway segments with comparable geometry and 85th percentile speeds to I-264 in VB and post them at 60 or 65 mph without compromising safety.
BTW I emailed VDOT about this, but they said I have to be a Virginia resident (I live in Arizona). I visit Hampton Roads a lot to visit my aunt, but unfortunately it has to be under her name. If anyone from Virginia can do me this favor to try to convince VDOT to raise the speed limit, that would be greatly appreciated, and my aunt would also appreciate it.

That is not the VDOT that I know

Things change over time...

The idea that an out-of-state resident can't comment on road conditions in another state is ludicrous.

30 years ago, I frequently emailed West Virginia with questions. 10 years later, the guy who I was emailing in West Virginia became my boss in Kentucky.

[Beltway]

That is not the VDOT that I know
Snippage restored:
That is not the VDOT that I know -- they take comments from other states. And NC is right across the border from Hampton Roads. And metro D.C. includes Maryland and Washington.

Things change over time...

The idea that an out-of-state resident can't comment on road conditions in another state is ludicrous.
30 years ago, I frequently emailed West Virginia with questions. 10 years later, the guy who I was emailing in West Virginia became my boss in Kentucky.

Like I already said this state has two major metros that include another state. People commute from NC to Norfolk/Hampton Roads.

That metro also has huge numbers of military personnel that are stationed there but retain their home state residency.

NOVA with 2 million population is across the river from Maryland and D.C. which add 4 million.

So those other states have locals that are part of those metros and use their roads frequently. Can't just ignore them.

HBElkins is right -- in both Hampton Roads and NOVA, out‑of‑state users are structurally part of the Virginia network. VDOT can't pretend Maryland, D.C., or North Carolina users "don't count" when they make up a major share of daily traffic.

[1995hoo]

....

HBElkins is right -- in both Hampton Roads and NOVA, out‑of‑state users are structurally part of the Virginia network. VDOT can't pretend Maryland, D.C., or North Carolina users "don't count" when they make up a major share of daily traffic.

But regardless of all that, the idea that VDOT is somehow putting the Commonwealth at a "competitive disadvantage" because some roads' speed limits are too low is a ridiculous argument. I don't have a basis for comment on I-264, which is what prompted this subthread, because I haven't been on that road in years, but I will certainly agree with the overall proposition that there are various urban or suburban highways in Virginia on which the speed limit seems too low for various reasons. I find it very hard to imagine that any reasonable person is going to say, "I won't live there because the speed limits affect my quality of life."

Adherence to posted speed limits on most of Virginia's urban and suburban highways doesn't generally seem to be all that high anyway. My late father once said that given a choice between a speed limit that's too low but is not particularly enforced and a higher speed limit for which the police grant no tolerance, on balance he'd prefer the one that's too low as long as it's not insanely low. By "insanely low" he meant things like posting 40 mph on the Beltway, or New York City's practice of posting 50-mph speed limits. I can see the logic of his position, at least in urban and suburban areas.

[vdeane]

My late father once said that given a choice between a speed limit that's too low but is not particularly enforced and a higher speed limit for which the police grant no tolerance, on balance he'd prefer the one that's too low as long as it's not insanely low.

And that seems to be typical across the country.  I'm the unicorn for preferring the higher limit with strict enforcement, but then, I'm naturally inclined to follow the rules and don't want to have to play ticket roulette by guessing which roads have which tolerance.  Residents support it because speeding has become a part of American culture.  Politicians support it allegedly because of the cultural reasons ("if we raise the limit, people will just go even faster!") but I suspect the real reason is because it gives the police a broad discretion to pull over anyone they want (with speeding being the pretext stop).

[Beltway]

But regardless of all that, the idea that VDOT is somehow putting the Commonwealth at a "competitive disadvantage" because some roads' speed limits are too low is a ridiculous argument. I don't have a basis for comment on I-264, which is what prompted this subthread, because I haven't been on that road in years, but I will certainly agree with the overall proposition that there are various urban or suburban highways in Virginia on which the speed limit seems too low for various reasons. I find it very hard to imagine that any reasonable person is going to say, "I won't live there because the speed limits affect my quality of life."

My experience with high familiarity in eastern seaboard states is that Virginia speed limits are pretty typical for the region.

Some western states may have cultural differences with regard to highway speeds, but I have not researched it in depth.

I do know that California has a maximum large truck speed limit of 55 mph. I do not favor split car/truck speed limits, they cause flow disruption in my opinion.

Virginia and most eastern seaboard states have one speed limit for both. So a 70 mph, 65 mph, 60 mph, speed limit is for both cars and trucks. Much better from a traffic flow standpoint. You don't have the problem with a 55 mph truck passing a 50 mph truck while cars get bottled up behind them and creating safety issues.

[1995hoo]

^^^^

You might recall that Virginia used to have a separate speed limit for trucks and buses back when 65-mph speed limits first returned to rural Interstates in the late 1980s. If I recall correctly, that was later changed to apply just to trucks, and then I believe it was when George Allen was governor in the mid-1990s that it was removed altogether (although school buses remained subject to an asinine 45-mph limit, enforced by a hard governor, for many years after that).

I agree with you that I don't think Virginia is all that out of line on the East Coast overall. I always find it remarkable when I visit our relatives in Broward County, Florida, that I-75 through that area has a 70-mph speed limit and that it would almost certainly be 55 mph here (except for the barrier-separated HO/T lanes, of course), but I shrug that off. Back when Virginia finally restored 70-mph speed limits during Bob McDonnell's term as governor I was mildly surprised (and pleased, of course) that the proposal didn't encounter more resistance in the General Assembly, simply because it was a significant departure from the way the Commonwealth had handled speed limits in the then 15 years since the NMSL repeal. And with that said, the thing I always found more significant about the NMSL repeal was that it allowed states flexibility on urban highways and on non-Interstates. I was attending law school at the time and living in Durham, North Carolina. No roads in the Durham area went up to 70 mph after the repeal (I-85 north of town was under construction), but a good chunk of the Durham Freeway (NC-147) went up to 65 after being ineligible for anything above 55 under the NMSL. In the scheme of things it doesn't make a lot of difference on the types of short local trips and commuting for which I routinely used that road, but on the other hand, as vdeane notes there's theoretically a benefit to having to worry less about police enforcement. (Although back then I drove a lot faster than I do now and I used to do 80 mph on that road, so I doubt I would have escaped a ticket had I been pulled over regardless of what the speed limit was. But I never got pulled over.)

[Plutonic Panda]

I-85 through between I-285 and GA-317 carries 10+ lanes with a 70 mph speed limit.

including an express toll lane that requires getting over 4+ lanes to make an exit...just nuts

What's nuts about it?

[sprjus4]

Not counting the express lanes, VDOT has made two general purpose speed changes in the Hampton Roads area over the last 8 or so years.

I-64 on the Peninsula was raised from 60 mph to 65 mph for around 9 miles.

I-64 in Virginia Beach and Norfolk was raised from 55 mph to 60 mph for a few miles between the Chesapeake/Virginia Beach city line and I-264 last year.

While I can understand some pause jumping straight from 55 mph to 65 mph, some of those roads such as I-264 could reasonable handle 60 mph east of VA-225 Independence Blvd, as well as in Portsmouth closer to Bowers Hill.

I-64 in Chesapeake, as well as I-664 on the Southside and US-58 around Suffolk and Franklin could also reasonably go up to 65 mph. All of those are currently posted at 60 mph.

[WillWeaverRVA]

So, for some reason the Powhite Parkway extension has been transformed back into a 2-lane road with grading to allow for widening to 4 lanes. It appears to not be a freeway or super-2, but will instead have a limited number of at-grade intersections.

I guess Magnolia Green got what they wanted after all.

https://chesterfieldcova.portal.civicclerk.com/event/2029/files/report/7248

[jb_va23]

So, for some reason the Powhite Parkway extension has been transformed back into a 2-lane road with grading to allow for widening to 4 lanes. It appears to not be a freeway or super-2, but will instead have a limited number of at-grade intersections.

I guess Magnolia Green got what they wanted after all.

https://chesterfieldcova.portal.civicclerk.com/event/2029/files/report/7248

I think the road being two lanes is a mistake, but bare minimum, if they are dead set on starting with two lanes it should be a super-2. 

[plain]

So, for some reason the Powhite Parkway extension has been transformed back into a 2-lane road with grading to allow for widening to 4 lanes. It appears to not be a freeway or super-2, but will instead have a limited number of at-grade intersections.

I guess Magnolia Green got what they wanted after all.

https://chesterfieldcova.portal.civicclerk.com/event/2029/files/report/7248

This shit is goofy as hell. If they actually do this it will be screwed within a year of opening. Might as well slap tolls on it if they can't build a full freeway without them.

[sprjus4]

At this point, just build the full freeway from VA-288 to US-360, and toll it. It's going to take 20 years to build if they phase it.

Edit: I see the plan has the entire 9 mile facility being constructed at once as two lanes, and with "high capacity at-grade intersections". That is even worse, IMO. I see a busy 2 lane road with traffic backing up at each red light, just becoming another US-360 with only one lane in each direction. The whole point of the road was to be a freeway bypass to US-360 (free flowing, 60+ mph, etc.), not become another US-360 (clogged, red lights, 45 mph, etc.)