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Author Topic: Virginia  (Read 919393 times)

Jmiles32

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5350 on: October 27, 2020, 05:30:29 PM »

I feel like I-77 will involve some sort of widening and truck climbing lanes in area.

Can't see virtually anything for I-85 or I-295 - those highways are perfectly adequate.

Agreed although I wouldn't be surprised if some recommendations were made for the portion of I-85 through Petersburg since this stretch was once part of the old RPT and has by far the highest AADT (60,000). Probably just safety improvements though.

For I-66, since I doubt much will be recommended east of Haymarket (although I'd still like to see the completion of 3 westbound gp lanes from Exit 71 (VA-120) to Exit 67 (VA-267), my guess is that fixing the current left lane merge at Exit 23 (very dangerous IMO) and adding auxiliary lanes between Exits 27 and 28 will be the biggest/most expensive improvement recommendations.
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sprjus4

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5351 on: October 28, 2020, 09:56:50 PM »

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5352 on: October 28, 2020, 11:05:15 PM »

VDOT and the CTB have released their initial recommendations for the I-64 / I-664 Corridor Improvement Study which covers the entire length of I-64 from the West Virginia line to Hampton Roads, along the entirety of I-664.

Forgot to mention this earlier but according to the recent I-64 / I-664 Corridor Improvement Study video, VDOT plans to conduct similar corridor improvement studies on I-77, I-85, I-295, and I-66. I obviously don't expect these to be done for quite a while but it will be interesting to see what type of improvements are recommended. Will probably be small things like traffic management, acceleration/deacceleration lane extensions, and possibly some truck climbing lanes, but we shall see.

Can't see virtually anything for I-85 or I-295 - those highways are perfectly adequate.

Thinking of I-85 and I-295 as a single rural corridor bypassing Petersburg, speed improvements are still needed (say increasing everything to at least 65 mph).  I-85 from Northern Dinwiddie to I-95 still has poor onramps and merge areas and needs other improvements to increase speeds.  Also, I think that some of the connection from I-85 to I-295 (along I-95 southbound) was still posted at 55 mph.  The slower zig-zag ramps from I-85 to I-95 threading in the collector/distributor for US-301 is probably OK, as is the weird cloverleaf ramp from I-95 northbound to I-85 southbound (leftover from the Richmond-Petersburg Turnpike).  How sad that I-795 never got completed, but remnant Wagner Road has never panned out as a viable shortcut.
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5353 on: October 29, 2020, 12:34:27 AM »

VDOT and the CTB have released their initial recommendations for the I-64 / I-664 Corridor Improvement Study which covers the entire length of I-64 from the West Virginia line to Hampton Roads, along the entirety of I-664.

Forgot to mention this earlier but according to the recent I-64 / I-664 Corridor Improvement Study video, VDOT plans to conduct similar corridor improvement studies on I-77, I-85, I-295, and I-66. I obviously don't expect these to be done for quite a while but it will be interesting to see what type of improvements are recommended. Will probably be small things like traffic management, acceleration/deacceleration lane extensions, and possibly some truck climbing lanes, but we shall see.

Can't see virtually anything for I-85 or I-295 - those highways are perfectly adequate.

Thinking of I-85 and I-295 as a single rural corridor bypassing Petersburg, speed improvements are still needed (say increasing everything to at least 65 mph).  I-85 from Northern Dinwiddie to I-95 still has poor onramps and merge areas and needs other improvements to increase speeds.  Also, I think that some of the connection from I-85 to I-295 (along I-95 southbound) was still posted at 55 mph.  The slower zig-zag ramps from I-85 to I-95 threading in the collector/distributor for US-301 is probably OK, as is the weird cloverleaf ramp from I-95 northbound to I-85 southbound (leftover from the Richmond-Petersburg Turnpike).  How sad that I-795 never got completed, but remnant Wagner Road has never panned out as a viable shortcut.
From my experience, I-85 warrants a connection to I-295. The northern few miles do get congested, and there's no reason traffic shouldn't be using the bypass.

sprjus4

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5354 on: October 29, 2020, 08:20:53 AM »

^

A lot of through traffic on I-85 North usually just defaults onto I-95 North through Petersburg and Richmond because to get to I-295, it involves a good bit of backtracking, which unless I-95 is congested, is not viable.

VA-895 serves as a connector to I-295 between the cities, but again, is still out of the way and not viable unless theres congestion.

VA-895 has better usage for traffic from I-85 and I-95 North to I-64 East to points such as Williamsburg and parts of the Peninsula, which isnt a whole lot, plus considering the $4+ toll for the short roadway that can easily be avoided.
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1995hoo

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5355 on: October 29, 2020, 08:23:47 AM »

It's actually only four miles south from I-85 to I-295. There's really not a ton of reason not to go that way. I remember the first time I did so was because I was moving my stuff from Durham back to Fairfax County and my car was so crammed full of stuff that I had trouble seeing out of my mirrors, so I thought the lower traffic volumes on I-295 meant that road would be the safer route (especially compared to the twisty stretch through Richmond).
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sprjus4

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5356 on: October 29, 2020, 08:30:28 AM »

^

Assuming free flow travel conditions, Google Maps estimates an additional 10 minutes and 14 miles to follow I-295 vs. I-95. It takes about 10-12 minutes to reach I-295 at the same horizontal position around Fort Lee that I-85 meets I-95 in Petersburg.

Thats extending a trip from 30 minutes to 40 minutes. During heavy traffic? Might be desirable. Middle of the day? At night? Probably not.

Theres a sign on I-95 South north of I-295 that tells long distance traffic to I-85 South Atlanta to follow I-95 South.
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Mapmikey

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5357 on: October 29, 2020, 08:32:51 AM »

From a time standpoint there is nothing wrong with using US 460 Business between I-85/95 and I-295 vs. taking 95 south to 295. 

Unless you have trouble keeping it at the speed limit of 40.

But this is the way I always make this connection.
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sprjus4

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5358 on: October 29, 2020, 08:36:13 AM »

Ive taken US-460 Business a couple times recently coming from either I-95 South, US-460 West, and I-85 North, and despite the artificially low limit, traffic is usually flowing around 50-55 mph so it usually isnt a problem. Just watch for police.

If I wasnt heading to US-460 East, but to I-295 North, Id probably just stay on the interstate.
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1995hoo

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5359 on: October 29, 2020, 08:45:45 AM »

^

Assuming free flow travel conditions, Google Maps estimates an additional 10 minutes and 14 miles to follow I-295 vs. I-95. It takes about 10-12 minutes to reach I-295 at the same horizontal position around Fort Lee that I-85 meets I-95 in Petersburg.

Thats extending a trip from 30 minutes to 40 minutes. During heavy traffic? Might be desirable. Middle of the day? At night? Probably not.

Theres a sign on I-95 South north of I-295 that tells long distance traffic to I-85 South Atlanta to follow I-95 South.

I guess in the scheme of things, whether that 10-minute difference matters depends on the context of your overall trip. If it's a relatively local trip, that might be a big difference. In my case, if I'm going through there it's always part of a longer overall driveback in the 1990s it was between Fairfax County and my apartment on Duke's Central Campus, or nowadays it would be more likely to be a longer trip such as to or from Charlotte or Atlanta (if I even used I-95 and I-85 at all for that drive). The last time I drove through there, we were coming back from Columbia, where we had stopped for the night on the way home from Florida. In the circumstances of a drive of that length, 10 minutes is trivial compared to the overall length of the trip. I think I did indeed loop south to I-295 on that drive, mainly just because I didn't want to put up with the lower speed limits on I-95.

But then, this IS a forum full of people who will think nothing of going 100 miles out of the way just to drive on a different road, so surely you will understand why going four miles out of the way is no big deal to someone here! Certainly, though, I understand why to many average drivers out there it would be deemed unacceptable to connect via I-95 because "you're going the wrong way." I used to work with a guy who wouldn't walk to the Metro stop nearest to our office on his trip home (unless he had to make another stop in that direction) because it was in the "wrong direction" relative to where he lived and he said mentally it made the commute feel longer.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2020, 08:51:29 AM by 1995hoo »
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Dirt Roads

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5360 on: October 29, 2020, 09:08:50 AM »

VDOT and the CTB have released their initial recommendations for the I-64 / I-664 Corridor Improvement Study which covers the entire length of I-64 from the West Virginia line to Hampton Roads, along the entirety of I-664.

Forgot to mention this earlier but according to the recent I-64 / I-664 Corridor Improvement Study video, VDOT plans to conduct similar corridor improvement studies on I-77, I-85, I-295, and I-66. I obviously don't expect these to be done for quite a while but it will be interesting to see what type of improvements are recommended. Will probably be small things like traffic management, acceleration/deacceleration lane extensions, and possibly some truck climbing lanes, but we shall see.

Can't see virtually anything for I-85 or I-295 - those highways are perfectly adequate.

Thinking of I-85 and I-295 as a single rural corridor bypassing Petersburg, speed improvements are still needed (say increasing everything to at least 65 mph).  I-85 from Northern Dinwiddie to I-95 still has poor onramps and merge areas and needs other improvements to increase speeds.  Also, I think that some of the connection from I-85 to I-295 (along I-95 southbound) was still posted at 55 mph.  The slower zig-zag ramps from I-85 to I-95 threading in the collector/distributor for US-301 is probably OK, as is the weird cloverleaf ramp from I-95 northbound to I-85 southbound (leftover from the Richmond-Petersburg Turnpike).  How sad that I-795 never got completed, but remnant Wagner Road has never panned out as a viable shortcut.

I commuted regularly between Central NC and Northern Virginia for more than 10 years.  Tried all of these tricks multiple times at various times of the day, and still use I-95 through downtown when traffic permits.  Not intending to offend sprjus4, but my post was to refute the comment that I-85 doesn't need improvements by pointing out some areas on both I-85 and I-295 that could benefit from smaller projects that would permit the increase of speed limits.  Totally agree that both I-85 and I-295 are adequate most of the time, albeit marginally so.

From my experience, I-85 warrants a connection to I-295. The northern few miles do get congested, and there's no reason traffic shouldn't be using the bypass.

I agree.  However, I think that the primary justification is not the volume of long-distance traffic but rather to divert any traffic that is adding to local rush hour congestion.  But since I've never seen I-85 north of Exit 63 (US-1 Boydton Plank Road) get to Level D congestion or worse, I'm sure that VDOT has more important fish to fry.  But a more direct connection to I-285 should be a preferred alternative as compared to an expensive widening of I-85.
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sprjus4

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5361 on: October 29, 2020, 11:38:30 AM »

Not intending to offend sprjus4, but my post was to refute the comment that I-85 doesn't need improvements by pointing out some areas on both I-85 and I-295 that could benefit from smaller projects that would permit the increase of speed limits.  Totally agree that both I-85 and I-295 are adequate most of the time, albeit marginally so.

Thinking of I-85 and I-295 as a single rural corridor bypassing Petersburg, speed improvements are still needed (say increasing everything to at least 65 mph).  I-85 from Northern Dinwiddie to I-95 still has poor onramps and merge areas and needs other improvements to increase speeds.  Also, I think that some of the connection from I-85 to I-295 (along I-95 southbound) was still posted at 55 mph.  The slower zig-zag ramps from I-85 to I-95 threading in the collector/distributor for US-301 is probably OK, as is the weird cloverleaf ramp from I-95 northbound to I-85 southbound (leftover from the Richmond-Petersburg Turnpike).  How sad that I-795 never got completed, but remnant Wagner Road has never panned out as a viable shortcut.
The only improvements I could think of for I-85 would be acceleration lane / deceleration lane extensions at the Squirrel Level Rd interchange, and a potentially more extensive reconstruction / reconfiguration of the I-95 interchange.

When looking at the scope of the Corridor Improvement Studies and improvements recommended for I-95, I-81, and now I-64, large scale improvements seem to not be the picture in many cases, except when sorely needed - which they did recommend 6 lane widening of I-64 between Richmond and Williamsburg, but not 8 lane widening on I-95 at least north of Fredericksburg -

Given the few times I've driven I-85 between I-95 and US-301 (the Turnpike segment), I'd argue the speed limit could be raised to 65 mph even now. Traffic seems to move at 70 - 75 mph, even pushed 80 mph once going with a group of other cars, without any issues, and increasing it would bring it closer to reality. Wouldn't necessarily recommend 70 mph as an official limit there due to curvature, narrow alignment, etc.

Going back to the I-64 discussion, one place I'd certainly like to see a speed limit increase is along I-664 in Chesapeake and Suffolk to at least 65 mph, along with potentially I-64 between Bowers Hill and Indian River Rd once the High Rise Bridge / I-64 widening is completed in that area. The speed limit east of I-464, and along the High Rise Bridge corridor before construction began is / was 60 mph. Before the 1974 55 mph reduction, the speed limit was posted at 65 mph both along that stretch of I-64 and along I-264 / then VA-44 east of I-64 to the Oceanfront. VDOT recently increased the speed limit on a busy, urban 8 lane segment of I-64 in Newport News from 60 mph to 65 mph, and has hardly made a difference as far as increasing driving speeds - it's simply closer to the reality (70 - 75 mph). I was hoping this would be the start of more increases, but ever since that one in 2018, there has not been any others in the region.

I think I did indeed loop south to I-295 on that drive, mainly just because I didn't want to put up with the lower speed limits on I-95.
That could also indeed be a factor. 55 / 60 mph along I-95 vs. 70 mph on I-295. I'm not ruling out I-295 as an alternative, I'm just indicating that the majority following a GPS and guide signage are likely going to follow I-95 North through Petersburg and Richmond.

But then, this IS a forum full of people who will think nothing of going 100 miles out of the way just to drive on a different road, so surely you will understand why going four miles out of the way is no big deal to someone here! Certainly, though, I understand why to many average drivers out there it would be deemed unacceptable to connect via I-95 because "you're going the wrong way." I used to work with a guy who wouldn't walk to the Metro stop nearest to our office on his trip home (unless he had to make another stop in that direction) because it was in the "wrong direction" relative to where he lived and he said mentally it made the commute feel longer.
Agreed. I'm not one who does out of the way drives a lot, though have done some pretty recently, including taking I-95, I-295, and I-64 as opposed to US-58 coming from the south, mainly to clinch I-95 between Emporia and Petersburg, and to see the recently complete / on-going construction on the Peninsula and outside Richmond, and recently taking I-85 North to US-460 to clinch I-85 between South Hill and Petersburg. Frankly, the I-85 to US-460 route isn't a terrible alternative - it's only about 15 minutes longer over a 90 minute trip, and only has around 50 miles of arterial highway vs. nearly 100 on US-58. The trade-off though is 50 miles of undivided highway, towns, etc. Usually, if it's outside of peak hours and I'm coming from I-85 in central NC, I'll usually just take I-40 and US-64 over to I-95 to connect to US-58 at Emporia - or keep going to US-17, to avoid that 55 mph 30 mile stretch between South Hill and Emporia on US-58.
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Dirt Roads

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5362 on: October 29, 2020, 12:06:02 PM »

I think I did indeed loop south to I-295 on that drive, mainly just because I didn't want to put up with the lower speed limits on I-95.

That could also indeed be a factor. 55 / 60 mph along I-95 vs. 70 mph on I-295. I'm not ruling out I-295 as an alternative, I'm just indicating that the majority following a GPS and guide signage are likely going to follow I-95 North through Petersburg and Richmond.

But then, this IS a forum full of people who will think nothing of going 100 miles out of the way just to drive on a different road, so surely you will understand why going four miles out of the way is no big deal to someone here! Certainly, though, I understand why to many average drivers out there it would be deemed unacceptable to connect via I-95 because "you're going the wrong way." I used to work with a guy who wouldn't walk to the Metro stop nearest to our office on his trip home (unless he had to make another stop in that direction) because it was in the "wrong direction" relative to where he lived and he said mentally it made the commute feel longer.

Agreed. I'm not one who does out of the way drives a lot, though have done some pretty recently, including taking I-95, I-295, and I-64 as opposed to US-58 coming from the south, mainly to clinch I-95 between Emporia and Petersburg, and to see the recently complete / on-going construction on the Peninsula and outside Richmond, and recently taking I-85 North to US-460 to clinch I-85 between South Hill and Petersburg. Frankly, the I-85 to US-460 route isn't a terrible alternative - it's only about 15 minutes longer over a 90 minute trip, and only has around 50 miles of arterial highway vs. nearly 100 on US-58. The trade-off though is 50 miles of undivided highway, towns, etc. Usually, if it's outside of peak hours and I'm coming from I-85 in central NC, I'll usually just take I-40 and US-64 over to I-95 to connect to US-58 at Emporia - or keep going to US-17, to avoid that 55 mph 30 mile stretch between South Hill and Emporia on US-58.

All of which reminds me that most of my hard-core roadtripping was done during the 1980s while covering railroad projects all over the place.  I could justify out-of-the-way roadtrips because in most cases the distances were much shorter, and travel times were compared to congested four-lane Interstates posted at 55 mph.  Back then, I would never go and backtrack the 4 miles just to hop on I-295, because it surely took 20 to 25 minutes longer than the Chippenham (VA-150) or even using Belt Boulevard (VA-161) through town to get around rush hour.   That was all before the Chippenham and the Powhite Parkway (Toll VA-76) got extended for more options.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5363 on: October 29, 2020, 02:37:09 PM »

^

A lot of through traffic on I-85 North usually just defaults onto I-95 North through Petersburg and Richmond because to get to I-295, it involves a good bit of backtracking, which unless I-95 is congested, is not viable.

VA-895 serves as a connector to I-295 between the cities, but again, is still out of the way and not viable unless theres congestion.

VA-895 has better usage for traffic from I-85 and I-95 North to I-64 East to points such as Williamsburg and parts of the Peninsula, which isnt a whole lot, plus considering the $4+ toll for the short roadway that can easily be avoided.

While it is true that VA-895 is a path between I-95 and I-295, it is not cheap, and was not really built for that purpose.

Having a connection of some kind between I-85 and I-295 is a good idea for a few reasons:

1. Network redundancy
2. Might encourage some drivers headed south on I-95 to I-85 to avoid the former Richmond-Petersburg Turnpike section of I-95 through Richmond (that is the one section of highway in metropolitan Richmond that showed significant recurring congestion when I looked at it a few years ago)
3. Reduces the need for major improvements in the interchange where I-85 terminates at I-95
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5364 on: November 03, 2020, 04:10:19 PM »

My cut across between I-85 and I-295 is usually via VA-10. Its a decent enough divided roadway and it hasn't been too busy the times I've used it. It doesn't avoid the sometimes crowded part of I-95 thru Colonial Heights though.
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5365 on: November 03, 2020, 08:47:05 PM »

My cut across between I-85 and I-295 is usually via VA-10. Its a decent enough divided roadway and it hasn't been too busy the times I've used it. It doesn't avoid the sometimes crowded part of I-95 thru Colonial Heights though.

I used to do this for many years until the area around the Sheetz at Rivers Bend started to get congested.
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5366 on: November 03, 2020, 09:03:09 PM »

My cut across between I-85 and I-295 is usually via VA-10. Its a decent enough divided roadway and it hasn't been too busy the times I've used it. It doesn't avoid the sometimes crowded part of I-95 thru Colonial Heights though.

I used to do this for many years until the area around the Sheetz at Rivers Bend started to get congested.
Theres also construction on quite a bit of that stretch of VA 10 now, along with the nearby Amazon distribution center thriving, making things even worse.

Having to drive I-95 up to Richmond every day now for work, it typically isnt that bad south of I-64 east (exit 75). The only part where traffic regularly slows down is the mess that is the merge area between West Broad and 64. Coming home on 64 westbound approaching 95 is also occasionally backed up due to frequent accidents.
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5367 on: November 04, 2020, 09:04:44 AM »

As a side note: the I-95/I-64 overlap as well as I-64 a couple miles west of it finally has lighting (well it's been lit for a month now). Hooray!!!
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1995hoo

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5368 on: November 04, 2020, 03:17:14 PM »

?s=20
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"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5369 on: November 04, 2020, 07:09:31 PM »

Looks good!

Can anyone explain the extra lane eastbound on 395 that is painted off? It starts right as the exit for Reagan Airport and Boundary Channel Drive leaves 395.

Sleuthing around on Street View, it looks like it might be a parking bay for WMATA employees to descend into the Metro tunnel, but then that lane was built back when the eastbound bridge was originally constructed around 1950? And well before the Metro came into existence. I guess its purpose could have changed.

EDIT: actually, the tunnel looks to go beneath 395 and has nothing to do with the Metro tunnel. I can see from historic aerials that it connected to a building that was originally between the two carriageways. But still, that tunnel also came well after construction of the 395's eastbound bridge.

There is a path that once connected it to this parking bay along the GW Parkway. I also don't know the purpose of this parking bay.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2020, 07:20:02 PM by jakeroot »
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5370 on: November 04, 2020, 08:38:53 PM »

Looks good!

Can anyone explain the extra lane eastbound on 395 that is painted off? It starts right as the exit for Reagan Airport and Boundary Channel Drive leaves 395.

Sleuthing around on Street View, it looks like it might be a parking bay for WMATA employees to descend into the Metro tunnel, but then that lane was built back when the eastbound bridge was originally constructed around 1950? And well before the Metro came into existence. I guess its purpose could have changed.

EDIT: actually, the tunnel looks to go beneath 395 and has nothing to do with the Metro tunnel. I can see from historic aerials that it connected to a building that was originally between the two carriageways. But still, that tunnel also came well after construction of the 395's eastbound bridge.

There is a path that once connected it to this parking bay along the GW Parkway. I also don't know the purpose of this parking bay.

I believe everything you are asking can be answered by reading replies 1791-1809 of this thread (pages 72-73).  It is fascinating.  Major credit goes to CP Zilliacus for the background on this topic,

There used to be 3 bus stops around this area and your GMSV links are to 2 of them.  The 3rd one is here (bus stop is to the left of barrels and the tunnel entrance to the right)  - https://goo.gl/maps/X5yP4LfU1anPzsRz6

They formed a pedestrian tunnel/walkway system to connect the building between the median you found (old Hot Shoppes) and also the Marriott Hotel that used to be at the very east end of Boundary Channel Dr.

The bus stops go back to about 1950 for the Hot Shoppes and the tunnels didn't come until later (by 1963) when the road network expanded and the Marriott also appeared.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2020, 08:43:00 PM by Mapmikey »
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5371 on: November 04, 2020, 10:01:08 PM »

^^^^

Its also funny to look back at those posts from over four years ago and to see that in post 1800 I mentioned a proposal to rebuild that area using roundabouts, given the tweet I linked to earlier today!
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5372 on: November 04, 2020, 11:09:39 PM »

Looks good!

Can anyone explain the extra lane eastbound on 395 that is painted off? It starts right as the exit for Reagan Airport and Boundary Channel Drive leaves 395.

Sleuthing around on Street View, it looks like it might be a parking bay for WMATA employees to descend into the Metro tunnel, but then that lane was built back when the eastbound bridge was originally constructed around 1950? And well before the Metro came into existence. I guess its purpose could have changed.

EDIT: actually, the tunnel looks to go beneath 395 and has nothing to do with the Metro tunnel. I can see from historic aerials that it connected to a building that was originally between the two carriageways. But still, that tunnel also came well after construction of the 395's eastbound bridge.

There is a path that once connected it to this parking bay along the GW Parkway. I also don't know the purpose of this parking bay.

I believe everything you are asking can be answered by reading replies 1791-1809 of this thread (pages 72-73).  It is fascinating.  Major credit goes to CP Zilliacus for the background on this topic,

There used to be 3 bus stops around this area and your GMSV links are to 2 of them.  The 3rd one is here (bus stop is to the left of barrels and the tunnel entrance to the right)  - https://goo.gl/maps/X5yP4LfU1anPzsRz6

They formed a pedestrian tunnel/walkway system to connect the building between the median you found (old Hot Shoppes) and also the Marriott Hotel that used to be at the very east end of Boundary Channel Dr.

The bus stops go back to about 1950 for the Hot Shoppes and the tunnels didn't come until later (by 1963) when the road network expanded and the Marriott also appeared.

A great read!! Thank you for mentioning those posts. I tried to do some searching but wasn't quite sure what to search exactly. I tried 395 + layby and other terms that roughly describe what they are...no results.

It is rather interesting that the bus stops were built almost exclusively for that restaurant and Marriott facility. Transit remains a very popular way to get around DC, but it seems like quite a lot of construction for two facilities that already had ample parking and likely didn't much care for the transit-goer. Unless I'm underestimating the importance of transit access in 50s DC...
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5373 on: November 05, 2020, 10:58:37 AM »

Looks good!

Can anyone explain the extra lane eastbound on 395 that is painted off? It starts right as the exit for Reagan Airport and Boundary Channel Drive leaves 395.

Sleuthing around on Street View, it looks like it might be a parking bay for WMATA employees to descend into the Metro tunnel, but then that lane was built back when the eastbound bridge was originally constructed around 1950? And well before the Metro came into existence. I guess its purpose could have changed.

EDIT: actually, the tunnel looks to go beneath 395 and has nothing to do with the Metro tunnel. I can see from historic aerials that it connected to a building that was originally between the two carriageways. But still, that tunnel also came well after construction of the 395's eastbound bridge.

There is a path that once connected it to this parking bay along the GW Parkway. I also don't know the purpose of this parking bay.

I believe everything you are asking can be answered by reading replies 1791-1809 of this thread (pages 72-73).  It is fascinating.  Major credit goes to CP Zilliacus for the background on this topic,

There used to be 3 bus stops around this area and your GMSV links are to 2 of them.  The 3rd one is here (bus stop is to the left of barrels and the tunnel entrance to the right)  - https://goo.gl/maps/X5yP4LfU1anPzsRz6

They formed a pedestrian tunnel/walkway system to connect the building between the median you found (old Hot Shoppes) and also the Marriott Hotel that used to be at the very east end of Boundary Channel Dr.

The bus stops go back to about 1950 for the Hot Shoppes and the tunnels didn't come until later (by 1963) when the road network expanded and the Marriott also appeared.

A great read!! Thank you for mentioning those posts. I tried to do some searching but wasn't quite sure what to search exactly. I tried 395 + layby and other terms that roughly describe what they are...no results.

It is rather interesting that the bus stops were built almost exclusively for that restaurant and Marriott facility. Transit remains a very popular way to get around DC, but it seems like quite a lot of construction for two facilities that already had ample parking and likely didn't much care for the transit-goer. Unless I'm underestimating the importance of transit access in 50s DC...

Similar freeway bus stop facilities exist in the L.A. area.  Here's one at US 101 @ Vermont Ave.

https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0799602,-118.2907413,3a,37.5y,298.33h,84.85t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdGzNO6WWW9sfj5srLfGoTw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Here's a view from the street (which runs above the freeway) to the stairs that one would take to get to the bus stop.  As the stops are not used any more, they are now gated off.  The freeway express buses that stopped here were removed when L.A.'s subway was built in the area.

https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0792858,-118.2917322,3a,15y,65.77h,83.3t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sYscY-BmWjxNt8tpwq5V6PQ!2e0!5s20190301T000000!7i16384!8i8192
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Re: Virginia
« Reply #5374 on: November 05, 2020, 01:36:00 PM »

Similar freeway bus stop facilities exist in the L.A. area.  Here's one at US 101 @ Vermont Ave.

https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0799602,-118.2907413,3a,37.5y,298.33h,84.85t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdGzNO6WWW9sfj5srLfGoTw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Here's a view from the street (which runs above the freeway) to the stairs that one would take to get to the bus stop.  As the stops are not used any more, they are now gated off.  The freeway express buses that stopped here were removed when L.A.'s subway was built in the area.

https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0792858,-118.2917322,3a,15y,65.77h,83.3t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sYscY-BmWjxNt8tpwq5V6PQ!2e0!5s20190301T000000!7i16384!8i8192

It looks like the outer stops are still used. Commuter Express 422? Looks like that route has more than a few freeway stops. Nearby Western Ave has a couple more.

That inside stop is definitely long closed, though (what was that used for anyways?). These stairs being open suggest that outer stops are still in use, although certainly not by anyone in a wheelchair!
« Last Edit: November 05, 2020, 01:38:02 PM by jakeroot »
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